[invertigo]

Originally Posted by pbaj12 ↗

From what I've read a lot of people have wrong information. I typed this up to help. I left out witness statements. I find inconsistencies and don't trust witness statements too much because of memory especially under stress and learned details.


Person1 29 year old. 5ft7. 185lbs.
Person2 17 year old. 5ft11. 158lbs.

The incident took place in 260 unit gated townhome community. Person1's race makes up one quarter to half of the community. Person2's race makes up one fifth.

The year prior the the incident, police were called to the community 402 times which included dozens of reports of attempted break-ins, 8 burglaries, 9 thefts and 1 shooting. Person1 called the police 7 times, 5 calls were to report suspicious men whose race was only told after being asked by police.

Six months before the incident, person1 had been selected by the community to be the neighborhood watch coordinator. Person1 had a license since 2009 to carry a firearm.

Three weeks prior to the incident, person1 called police to report a young man looking into the windows of an empty house. The person got away before police arrived. Several days later, workers witnessed two young males of the same race as person2 in the front yard of a house that was burglarized around the same time. The next day police discovered some of the stolen property in a backpack of a young man that was the same race as person2. Person1 identified the young man as the same person he saw several days earlier looking into the windows of an empty house.


On 2-26-12, person2 was in a local convenience store purchasing items at 18:24. At 18:29 person2 began walking back to the gated community. Person1 was driving through the neighborhood on an errand when he called police at 19:09 in regards to person2.

Transcript mildly edited for contact/personal information:
Begin 19:09
Police: Police Department
Person1: We've had some break-ins in my neighborhood, and there's a real suspicious guy... This guy looks like he's up to no good, or he's on drugs or something. It's raining and he's just walking around, looking about.
Police: OK, and this guy is he white, black, or hispanic?
Person1: He looks black.
Police: Did you see what he was wearing?
Person1: Yeah. A dark hoodie, like a grey hoodie, and either jeans or sweatpants and white tennis shoes. He's here now, he was just staring.
Police: OK, he's just walking around the area…
Person1: looking at all the houses.
Person1: Now he's just staring at me.
Police ask about location. Person1 clarifies.
Person1: Now he's coming towards me. He's got his hand in his waistband. And he's a black male.
Police: How old would you say he looks?
Person1: He's got button on his shirt, late teens.
Somethings wrong with him. Yup, he's coming to check me out. He's got something in his hands. I don't know what his deal is.
Police: Just let me know if he does anything, ok?
Person1: See if you can get an officer over here.
Police: Yeah we've got someone on the way, just let me know if this guy does anything else.
Person1: Okay. These assholes, they always get away.
Talking about directions...
Person1: ... Shit, he's running.
Police: He's running? Which way is he running?
Person1: Down towards the other entrance to the neighborhood.
Police: Which entrance is that that he's heading towards?
Person1: The back entrance. It's fucking cold.
Police: Are you following him?
Person1: Yeah.
Police: Ok, we don't need you to do that.
Talking about contact information..
Person1: He ran.
More contact information and location.
End at 19:13

19:16 There's a 911 call about a fight and a gunshot is heard seconds later.
19:17 Police arrive to find person2 lying face down in the grass with person1 standing nearby.
Person1's back is wet and has grass stains. Bleeding from the nose and back of head.

Person2 died of a single gunshot wound to the chest fired between 1 and 18 inches. There was a small injury on his left ring finger below the knuckle. No other injuries found.

I'm going to take that with a grain of salt. Where's the 'fucking punks' line? That's one of the most controversial aspects of the 911 call and it's missing... That transcript seems dubious to me

[pbaj12]

Originally Posted by invertigo ↗

I'm going to take that with a grain of salt. Where's the 'fucking punks' line? That's one of the most controversial aspects of the 911 call and it's missing... That transcript seems dubious to me

About 7 lines from the end you'll see I put "it's fucking cold" which is disputed if he said punks, cold or *****. After listening to the audio with some background noise removed it sounds like cold. Temperature that day was low 50's to high 60's. Seeing how it's later in the day, raining and both parties were wearing an extra layer to keep warm, person1 saying it's cold makes sense.

[AVo]

How many people actually watched the trail?

[poopie]

thought he was a 15 year old kid,,hes tall and musclar,,wth.

[DiamondSmiles]

Originally Posted by poopie ↗

thought he was a 15 year old kid,,hes tall and musclar,,wth.

The parents kept showing that cute picture of him with the grey hoodie from when he was about 12.

I believe he was 17, but, he did grow since the cute little boy picture.

Regardless of that photo, Zimmerman stalked, provoked him and did the wrong thing.

Zimmerman planned to take the money he got from the public and lied about, and run away with Cayley Anthony's incubator!

I'm telling you, all the jurors in both cases were on bath salts! That's where it all went during the recall.

[DiamondSmiles]

Originally Posted by Stanley1 ↗

It is not against the law to follow a suspicious person. Heck, it's not even against the law to walk up to a suspicious person, to ask what they are doing (if done in a non-threatening way). And a person has no legal obligation to listen to a 911 dispatcher. They are NOT the police.

Zimmerman might have been following Martin, but there is no proof his end goal was ever to approach him. He was following him to keep a visual so that the police, whom he called, could question Martin. Seems within reason to me, for a neighborhood watch captain.

From the evidence we have all been privy to, it sure seems like Martin got away, circled back around, and jumped Martin. THAT was the first crime committed. And at that point, Zimmerman has the right to defend himself.

Those making this out to be about race, or black america are foolish. The rallies, the rioting, it's all ridiculously stupid. All those bringing up Stand Your Ground, equally ridiculous. This wasn't a SYG defense. It was a self defense, defense.

From your quote,

"From the evidence we have all been privy to, it sure seems like Martin got away, circled back around, and jumped Martin."

Oh! Martin jumped himself?! That explains everything. I guess he shot himself as well.

It's stupid to stalk someone. Zimmerman instigated the situation. He provoked Martin.

It was Martin who tried to stand his ground and got blindsided by a gun.

Zimmerman, being an adult, although appearing much older than his stated age, should have had sense enough to go home.

Am I the only one who thinks if I'm in a motor vehicle and think someone looks suspiscious or up to no good, I would have beeen outta there?

It would have been the end of story and we'd have moved on to the next crime.

He was in a motor vehicle and Martin was on foot.

He wanted to be a hero. Instead, he's a murderer.

[pbaj12]

Originally Posted by diamondsmiles ↗

From your quote,

"From the evidence we have all been privy to, it sure seems like Martin got away, circled back around, and jumped Martin."

Oh! Martin jumped himself?! That explains everything. I guess he shot himself as well.

It's stupid to stalk someone. Zimmerman instigated the situation. He provoked Martin.

It was Martin who tried to stand his ground and got blindsided by a gun.

Zimmerman, being an adult, although appearing much older than his stated age, should have had sense enough to go home.

Am I the only one who thinks if I'm in a motor vehicle and think someone looks suspiscious or up to no good, I would have beeen outta there?

It would have been the end of story and we'd have moved on to the next crime.

He was in a motor vehicle and Martin was on foot.

He wanted to be a hero. Instead, he's a murderer.

From what it sounds like to me..

There were a string of robberies by people that may have looked similar to Martin. Zimmerman was annoyed that these guys were always getting away with it. He called the police who said an officer was on the way. Trying to locate Martin so he could tell the cops..they ran into each other. Martin believed he had to defend himself and attacked Zimmerman. Zimmerman escalated it because he too had to defend himself.

I don't think this case has anything to do about race other than the news and public trying to start drama between groups. Zimmerman was profiling Martin based on recent burglaries but that doesn't mean he was a racist or this was a hate crime. They both made poor decisions..Zimmerman should have waited for police and Martin should have fled. I can understand why each made the decision they did but there were better ones to choose from.

Zimmerman is more to blame than Martin but it was still self defense. If Martin killed Zimmerman, it would have been self defense.
Martin had his life taken away too early. I don't think Zimmerman is someone to fear or that should spend the rest of his life in jail. Having to worry about people trying to find him and living with his decision that night for the rest of his life are enough.


I'm more upset that public is putting so much into this. There are far worse cases and other things to be more concerned about but we don't see protests or the kind of support this has received. But when people watch mainstream media that comes from only a couple sources..what can you expect

[vulturedoors]

The photo of the gunshot wound shows clear stippling around the point of entry, and the stippling pattern is small. This means that the shot was fired from almost point-blank range, less than 12 inches away probably.

That's not the kind of wound you get when the shooter is "stalking" someone. That's the kind of wound you get when the shooter is being attacked and has managed to get his gun between him and the attacker out of sheer desperation.

Zimmerman was fighting for his life.

[chef1955]

[IMG][/IMG]
So if i see a person running down the street wearing a ski mask holding a TV, i can run after him and shoot and kill him, over that TV?
And if so, Can women stab and kill rapist?
And, one last question... I did know it was cool to walk up to strangers ask them questions... I dare everyone to pick random strangers walking down the street and ask who they, where they live and what they are doing!

[chef1955]

Originally Posted by vulturedoors ↗

The photo of the gunshot wound shows clear stippling around the point of entry, and the stippling pattern is small. This means that the shot was fired from almost point-blank range, less than 12 inches away probably.

That's not the kind of wound you get when the shooter is "stalking" someone. That's the kind of wound you get when the shooter is being attacked and has managed to get his gun between him and the attacker out of sheer desperation.

Zimmerman was fighting for his life.

So If Zimmerman was trying to kidnap TM, TM has no right to try to kill for trying to do?
Because I see little difference between detain and kidnap. At least for the point of view of a child who already is thinking Zimmerman was creepy.