[robot]

Originally Posted by Vedderman ↗

You dumb fuck.

Minneapolis is a sanctuary city. THEY ARE WILLINGLY TAKING THEM IN THERE.

Minnesota pays in a yearly average of 44 BILLION dollars more to the Federal Government than it takes in from the Federal government. So them being there costs no one ANYTHING outside of Minnesota. And Minnesota has voted reliably Blue for decades.

It costs you, as a taxpayer (assuming you even pay Federal taxes), FAR more to pay for all of these ICE raids in Blue sanctuary cities.

So what the fuck is your problem? Oh yeah...I see...



You're actually retarded. If you cared one fucking iota about the 'laws in this country' , why did you vote for a convicted felon with 34 counts on his jacket that he still hasn't done time for?

So go peddle that horseshit to someone who's buying it. The 'law' means nothing to you other than how you can wield it against people who don't like.

Ad hominem attacks don’t help. I hear what you’re saying—but this argument keeps getting flattened into slogans, and that’s the problem.

Yes—Minnesota is a donor state. That does not mean large-scale immigration has no real fiscal impact at the state and local level. Federal transfers don’t automatically cover housing, education, healthcare, workforce training, or emergency services that cities and states are legally required to provide. Those costs land locally, whether people like that reality or not.

You can oppose cruelty and still acknowledge capacity limits. These aren’t mutually exclusive positions.

On enforcement: today’s situation didn’t appear out of nowhere. IIRIRA radically expanded removals and detention in the 1990s. ICE enforced it under Bush and Obama (selectively, but decisively), and Trump removed most remaining discretion. Pretending this is a single-party phenomenon is historically false.

As for the claim that sanctuary cities “cost nothing”: federal enforcement actions are expensive, yes—but so is absorbing large populations without proportional federal investment in workforce training, education, housing, and integration. States are left to bridge that gap themselves.

Finally, none of this requires demonizing immigrants. People respond to incentives and legal structures that policymakers created. What we’re seeing now is the predictable result of decades of incoherent federal policy colliding with local realities.

If we want solutions instead of insults, we have to be able to talk honestly about both humanitarian obligations and fiscal constraints—without pretending either side doesn’t exist.

[goghingwilde]

Originally Posted by wolfie ↗

I often wondered what Andrew Jackson was like. I would say we are looking at a close match.

At least Jackson was man enough to shoot his enemies himself. I abhor Jackson and all his crimes against humanity, of course.

Trump has never had the guts to do anything himself except molest girls.

But to the topic at hand- yeah you’re spot on- the ego and the inhumanity displayed by Trump is very similar.

[HIGHTECHDUDE]

Originally Posted by Bunnyman1962 ↗

.....at the end of the day if this was a ICE siege where certain targets were supposed to be captured was it successful? Because at the moment we have 1 American citizen dead and a whole pile of finger pointing

As of 07 JAN 2026, "Operation Metro Surge" had apprehended over 1,500 dangerous immigrants in MN. Most of the arrestees were wanted for murder, rape, robbery, and pedophilia as well as human trafficking and illegal entry.

As far as activities specifically on the day of the shooting, no number has been published AFAIK. However, any ICE agents who weren't directly involved at the scene or surged there to protect ICE from the mobs of protestors were instructed to return to operations according to a source at the FBI.

[seleukosnikator]

It’s a shame. Without political faction, I just think if people can’t hold the same respect for Ashlii Babbitt or Charlie Kirk I’m not sure why they’d ask for it here. Take away emotion and factional bias and it just doesn’t make any sense. I personally think all of it sucks and that it is probably the optimal perspective if one is to ever reasonably ask for sympathy.

Originally Posted by foxfantastic ↗

Dude, this isn't Afghanistan, this is America, and THAT person could have been one of YOUR loved ones.

You're telling me death is the only way to apprehend someone who is just pulling away? There are multiple murderers who lead cops on highway chases for miles, and most of them are alive at the end.

You're telling me there was absolutely NO other solution to this problem other than cold-blooded murder?

[robot]

Originally Posted by Vedderman ↗

The crazy (and one of the saddest) part is that ICE basically did a perfectly fine job for 22 years. They did their work, they deported millions of illegals, very very few people ever got killed. They were reliable and relatively efficient. They weren't 'loved' but most normal citizens just tacitly accepted their role and went about their lives.

ICE operated quietly, professionally, and responsibly.

But Trump decided this term that 23% of the nation's voting age-of-majority population somehow equated with being a decisive mandate in his mind.

And being a reality tv star, real estate hustler, and narcissistic showman by nature, he decided that the best way to make sure everyone knew he had a 'mandate' was to make the whole fucking agency into a circus.

Out of the blue they're swarming the streets, no badges, no IDs, wearing masks to hide their faces from accountability. People are getting thrown into vans with no due process in front of crowds of witnesses. People are getting shot. People are getting beaten. American Citizens are being arrested by 'mistake' and stashed in cells with no access to their lawyers or families.

Actual illegals are being deported with no due process to foreign countries they have never even been to as part of back room deals where Trump is basically trading prison labor to other countries in exchange for favors or trade deals.

A Federal Judge ordered him to return them, as it was a violation of their Rights and the Law to sell them to some other country without due process. Trump ignored the court order and did it anyway, saying, "What are you gonna do, arrest me? I'm the fucking President. The only limit on my power is my mortality."

All of a sudden, after 22 years of ICE doing their job every day and no one really giving too much of a fuck about it, he re-tools them as an absurdly high-profile political weapon.

He starts targeting cities, not because they have the highest concentration of illegals, but because they are population centers for the opposition party. Not only that, but he deliberately uses ICE officers as terror troops, ordering them to put on big shows of force in Democratic cities only, terrifying citizens and intimidating crowds just because they voted against Trump. Or criticized him in the news.

He and Noem have utterly destroyed any credibility that agency had in the space of 12 short months. No one even remembers that they did their job well, discreetly, and responsibly for decades. Now hundreds of millions of people will remember them only as a weaponized terror squad, conducting bloody political theater for the circus ringleader who is only in this game for the limelight and the backhanders.

I'm from NYC. I work in social services related field. Under Obama, I would get call from local programs telling me about unmarked ICE vans picking people up. Please. Stop. It was different but there was also some sameness. We're talking about immigration status. In most if not all European countries, someone staying in a city more than 90 days reports to the local police their status. You can still offer sanctuary that way. We have no equivalent. The self reporting requirement under IIRAIRA had no teeth, hence, ICE in 2003. Arguably, Sanctuary City and State status is exacerbating - even giving Trump a button to push - difficult situations.

[HIGHTECHDUDE]

Originally Posted by Vedderman ↗

Yes, please. If you have links for a credible source that displays the evidence you are invoking, we do want to see it.

If it is too messy, WM and I will sort through it, burn the bullshit in the fire, and help you organize the rest.

Granted, if you want me to provide all this info, where's all your evidence in support of your argument? js

[Vedderman]

Originally Posted by robot ↗

If we want solutions instead of insults, we have to be able to talk honestly about both humanitarian obligations and fiscal constraints—without pretending either side doesn’t exist.

Solutions without insults are actually a fundamental impossibility with this president, you do understand that, yes? You do realize that he cannot go five minutes without mocking, blaming, or insulting someone? Literal impossibility unless you gag his orange face.

And, to be frank, I am not certain whether I put a Shock News site populated largely by political extremists, ghouls, necrophiliacs, foreigners with no english skills, and a disproportionately high amount of mental illness as one rung lower or one rung higher than the senile bully of a president who only has a nice word for anyone when he wants something from them.

But in either case, this country's problems aren't being solved in the Oval Office and they aren't being solved in here.

I have enough idealism in my bones that isn't completely torched yet that I will, say it'd be NICE if it were that easy.

But it's a non-starter. And I suspect, based on the general cogency of your post, that you are as aware of that as I am.

May as well just let 'boys be boys' and go back to shredding one another to pieces until I finally lock this thread down like Charlie Kirk and the site goes back to business as usual.

[goghingwilde]

Originally Posted by Lugia ↗

Can you show me where she used her vehicle as a weapon? Because these videos show her simply driving away and not at all in the direction of anyone.

Also looking for evidence of a "vehicle ramming" attack as the Secretary of Homeland Security called this.

We have plenty of videos on here showing real vehicle rammings, real crazy people who did fafo, real threats— what we saw was so far from that it’s crazy-but fascists turn into mewling quims the moment dear leader’s platoons whine, or commit a crime in broad daylight.


Also have we noticed how their bar for fuck around find out gets lower every day?

Protesting peacefully? Let’s maim you for life, or in this case, murder them.

I saw the Roosevelt school ice raid video and fascists were in there saying the kids shouldn’t have been there fafo. Like it was a school when it got out.

Not that they’ve cared about the dates of born kids in decades

[seleukosnikator]

Exactly. I can grasp why people hold opposing views and still respect their reasoning — but I can’t wrap my head around a total abandonment of consistency, where someone just indulges in raw, primate-level emotional glee because “I liked this person, but hated that one, so I’m glad they’re dead.”
It’s as if personal feelings somehow grant objective moral weight, and that’s supposed to be a coherent, adult position. These are volatile, labile reactions; they shouldn’t be the cornerstone of a mature, well-formed mind.

Originally Posted by DaBigNob ↗

See: Ashli Babbit

No leftists protested that murder by Capitol police, and it was shoot on sight, no warnings given.

[Vedderman]

Originally Posted by HIGHTECHDUDE ↗

Granted, if you want me to provide all this info, where's all your evidence in support of your argument? js

What argument? What evidence?

I stated clearly that everything I said was proven is available in one or all of the videos in this thread. Anything I could not prove to at least the burden of proof in civil court is clearly denoted as pure conjecture.

Conjecture is fine for discussions and arguments. Not every statement requires proof.

But when you made your post you specifically stated that you had reliable, verifiable evidence that she was part of some terrorist cell. That you had verified posts from her phone or social media account. That you had verified evidence of her having had past direct contact with ICE.

You also made bold claims that ICE was legally authorized to arrest any human being in the US for ANY crime whatsoever at any time. This is in direct dispute to the Federal code that Whiskey posted earlier and also to my own research. So I want to see the Federal code entry that attests that ICE has completely unlimited power of arrest and detainment without restriction or exception.