[realityhorror]

I'm sorry if I offended you with my post. By retaliatory I really mean that it's a perceived retaliation - eye for an eye stuff. It's not objective retaliation, just something that "evens things out" in their heads.

You're right about the humanitarian work, and that is a good thing that comes out of these conflicts. I didn't consider it in my argument. The cynic in me feels it's still a superficial gloss to an ugly business interest, but whatever the reason it is a measurable force for good. I don't doubt there have been sickening human rights violations in the middle east that have been stopped by American troops, and I know that the soldiers themselves are there to liberate and help people who have been oppressed. Soldiers do not determine policy, and I have no argument with them.

[realitynoshow]

Absolutely. If my few months on this site have taught me anything, it's to fear death by car crash rather than terrorist. I hope I never need to drive in Thailand.

Originally Posted by genericname79 ↗

My issue with the media focus on these rather minor incidents of terrorism is how they are blown out of proportion and how the threat of terroristic acts is greatly exaggerated. These incidents are sensationalistic and stir up emotions and nationalism. When compared with other modes of violence and death, the Jihadist threat is miniscule. Four people died in Boston. In 2012, there were 500 murders in Chicago. In 2010, over 10,000 people died in alcohol-related car crashes in the US. You are much more likely to die in a car accident than be blown up by a terrorist.

[brutuswakul]

Karma: When a wannabe muslim martyr is kept alive in a place called Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center. Enjoy those infidel blood transfusions!

[iwannasee]

This is crazy. The cops are saying the older brother was alive but wounded and they tackled him and were arresting him and the younger brother straight ran him over. ??????

"We're trying to get him (Tamerlan) handcuffed. There's two or three police officers handcuffing him in the street -- the older brother. At the same time, at the last minute -- they obviously have tunnel vision, it's a very, very stressful situation -- one of them yells out, 'Look out!' and here comes the black SUV, the carjacked car, directly at them. They dive out of the way, and he (the younger brother) drives over his brother and drags him a short distance down the street."
http://www.cnn.com/2013/04/20/us/bos...ils/index.html

[Pyramid_Head]

So much for being a brother.

[RealityUnfolding]

Originally Posted by realityhorror ↗

I'm sorry if I offended you with my post. By retaliatory I really mean that it's a perceived retaliation - eye for an eye stuff. It's not objective retaliation, just something that "evens things out" in their heads.

You're right about the humanitarian work, and that is a good thing that comes out of these conflicts. I didn't consider it in my argument. The cynic in me feels it's still a superficial gloss to an ugly business interest, but whatever the reason it is a measurable force for good. I don't doubt there have been sickening human rights violations in the middle east that have been stopped by American troops, and I know that the soldiers themselves are there to liberate and help people who have been oppressed. Soldiers do not determine policy, and I have no argument with them.

No offense at all. If I was offended I'd probably have far more choice words. Thanks for clarifying the retaliation part though. I argue both sides or I wouldn't bring up Ghaddafi. He was engaged in a war-like tit for tat. We asked him to do something, he did it. We asked again, he did it. Then we got involved in conflict and then attacked him. Then he said "Don't come in my water" and we responded by waving proverbial dicks around by sending the largest Naval fleet in history... just to show off. We likely bombed and killed his daughter (debate for another time), so he came back. I don't believe he is an angel of course, but he certainly wasn't the worst in the world.

But as for policy - I believe many (not all) have best interests at heart but they are ignorant to the very, very specific needs of the region. In a way, Iraq - now liberated from Saddam - needs to have their own civil war. We did it and we came out stronger. We think "Gee golly, if they had what America did!" but while some want to not be under a certain rule, they also don't want America's ways either. We should be listening harder to our ambassadors and to really consider multiple POVs in the area. So I do agree with you that policy itself isn't always the best ideas.

[RealityUnfolding]

As a bit of evidence on the policy - Bush really kickstarted our aid to Africa to reduce and hope to eliminate AIDS. BUT - he had people on the ground, listening to cultural concerns, policies and even tribal concerns. People make the dumbest jokes about him being a racist (or those that liked him are) but not only was that his mission, but Laura Bush went several times to set up clinics, distribute meds, condoms and education, often without media.

He didn't just do it as a Prez for "street cred". After he left, he's quiet in the media except when his foundation travels yet again to Africa (they've been... 8 times since he left office?) bring yet more supplies and a lot of the foundations money is his donations. The areas they have helped have cut new AIDS transmissions drastically. But again - they started by gathering info on how to approach the topic, treaded lightly when they first came, started slow, earned the trust of governments and the people and are making a huge impact - and ask for nothing in return at all.

[mariahorn]

Here's what I don't understand: if the thermal imaging on the helicopter was able to pick up the body, why didn't they try to use it the night before? I listened to the scanner feed throughout the entire 24 hour ordeal except a few hours Friday morning when I was teaching. There's conflicting reports of whether he was in the boat the entire time or just a few hours before being found, but there was no mention of infrared or other heat seeking technology mentioned at all Thursday night...mostly it was check the houses and then wait for daylight to look harder.

[woodsetton]

The newspapers in UK saying guy whose legs blown off was sat down when one of the bombers put a rucksack down on floor by him. When it went off, its amazing he died die instantly.

[RealityUnfolding]

Originally Posted by iwannasee ↗

This is crazy. The cops are saying the older brother was alive but wounded and they tackled him and were arresting him and the younger brother straight ran him over.

Back to the topic at hand. It looks as though they tried suicide by cop and to go out with a bang when the teen panicked and drove off. (My theory given CNN's write up.) Big bro dumps ammo into every body there, then storming the police, just feet away - ammo gone and... nothing? Why wear a bomb but not pull the trigger in a gunfight you assume leads to your death. Or I suppose he "sacrificed" himself and told the kid to drive off when he's out? If that pans out, then ironically the teen inadvertently saves lives.

The older one being done in by a cell phone, of a victim they let go no less, seems just laughable. Their only victim they didn't try to kill. Seems them telling him they are the bombers was a moment of attention.