[Kanda444]

Originally Posted by Flaka ↗

People just don't value life. Seriously, was it worth taking a life over Walmart products? Come on!

exactly! a person had to die because somebody didnt want Walmart to take a small loss.

[Kanda444]

Originally Posted by WinglessAngel ↗

My personal experiences have caused me to destain a majority of law enforcement officers and I usually side with civilians; not this time.

She was confronted by someone in authority. She failed to follow his directions and well ....I guess she doesn't need to worry about returning any of the gifts she likely would have been displeased with for Christmas. Arrogant bitch.

"minor shoplifting"? There's no such thing, the epic proportions of the crime has risen so high it's staggering. Maybe the next time her girlfriends want to head for for some freebies they'll think twice and do us all a favor. If there were more deaths maybe we all wouldn't have to pay so much for added security measures.

shoplifting is a minor offense, even to the companies they are stealing from. i worked in retail for a long time....many years in box stores like this. they buy their product for about a third of what they charge you. they make enough profit even with shoplifting. they budget in shoplifting into their controllable losses every year....they plan for it and understand it's a part of business. they hire security guards for their presence.... to minimize shoplifting, not to patrol, arrest and detain shoplifters.

i would bet they weren't shoplifting for the fun of it.....

[Kanda444]

Originally Posted by PlinyTheYounger ↗

Technically, she put herself in danger by stealing in the first place. Of course he shouldn't have shot her; but in the moment, I probably would have shot too. Quick thinking is different than thinking in general. He was going off instinct as a security guard to apprehend, pursue, and react. In the end it was fight or flight.

i agree that his response was fight or flight and i dont think he should be charged with murder or anything....it's just tragic to me that it ended like that. as somebody who has trained in loss prevention, this is the last result a person or company wants from the apprehension of a shoplifter and with him being an LEO, i would expect him to respond more appropriately, considering the training he's likely had...i mean, he followed the two women and two kids to their car to try to apprehend them for shoplifting...with a firearm. i know better than that...so should he.

[PlinyTheYounger]

Originally Posted by Kanda444 ↗

i agree that his response was fight or flight and i dont think he should be charged with murder or anything....it's just tragic to me that it ended like that. as somebody who has trained in loss prevention, this is the last result a person or company wants from the apprehension of a shoplifter and with him being an LEO, i would expect him to respond more appropriately, considering the training he's likely had...i mean, he followed the two women and two kids to their car to try to apprehend them for shoplifting...with a firearm. i know better than that...so should he.

He shouldn't have shot through the windshield...maybe the tires? Get the license plate too.

[Kanda444]

Originally Posted by PlinyTheYounger ↗

He shouldn't have shot through the windshield...maybe the tires? Get the license plate too.

especially since rounds fired through auto glass tend to veer off course.....under pressure though, i imagine he didnt have time to think. tires may have worked but it's hard to hit a moving target with a handgun. i feel bad for all involved, including the officer.

[nickakbar]

wow thats some crazy shit

[Seven Of Nine]

Originally Posted by Kanda444 ↗

shoplifting is a minor offense, even to the companies they are stealing from. i worked in retail for a long time....many years in box stores like this. they buy their product for about a third of what they charge you. they make enough profit even with shoplifting. they budget in shoplifting into their controllable losses every year....they plan for it and understand it's a part of business. they hire security guards for their presence.... to minimize shoplifting, not to patrol, arrest and detain shoplifters.

i would bet they weren't shoplifting for the fun of it.....

I have to completely disagree with your comment in its' entirety.

It was estimated in 2001 (that's a long time ago so inflate these numbers) that the cost to US merchants, as a result of shoplifting, was 25 MILLION DOLLARS PER DAY. All the top suits of all the corporations combined can't 'plan' for that kind of loss.

I'd LOVE to see what you'd do if you caught someone stealing from a store you owned. Say you opened a big old Bong shop, poured every cent of your earnings into it, spent years struggling to turn your investment into a profit and some stupid, mindless, arrogant punk or bitch walks up and just TAKES your shit ...what would you do Kanda? He's just fucking with you now and you know you've lost tens of thousands of dollars to other shoplifters, now this guy is in his car and you're still trying to protect your stuff because it's what you do for a living. What are you going to do Kanda? You're gonna just wave BuhBye and blow him a kiss? I didn't think so.

The following are just a few things that we, as consumers, pay for to prevent punk ass bitches like that dead chick from taking shit because they feel they are entitled to it (even if it's your shit Kanda).
--------------------------
Anti-shoplifting options

Closed circuit television
CCTV monitoring is an important anti shoplifting method. Retailers focused on loss prevention often devote most of their resources to this technology.

Electronic article surveillance
Electronic article surveillance is second only to CCTV in popularity amongst retailers looking for inventory protection. EAS refers to the security tags that attach to a garment and cause an alarm to sound when removed from the store.

Phony shoppers
Loss Prevention personnel will patrol the store acting as if they are real shoppers. They may try on merchandise and browse the racks, all the while looking for signs of shoplifting and looking for possible shoplifters. Many large retail companies utilize this technique, and will watch a shoplifter conceal an item then stop them after they have exited the store.

Uniformed guards
Mostly used by high end retail establishments. The presence of a uniformed guard acts as a deterrent to shoplifting activity.

Exit inspections
Costco shoppers are familiar with this. No shopping cart gets out the door until its contents are compared against the register tape. In most of the US, however, shoppers are under no obligation to accede to a search unless the employee has reasonable grounds to suspect shoplifting. All retail employees are instructed not to block the exit in the face of a customer determined to leave without showing the receipt.

Close customer service
Floor attendants are instructed to greet, follow, and offer help with their shopping. Shoplifters are not comfortable with this attention and will go somewhere else where they can work unnoticed.

BOB mirrors
Bottom of basket mirrors are commonly used in grocery stores where the check out lanes are close together and the cashier might be unable to see the entire basket to ensure there are no items being unpaid for.

Locked merchandise
Some merchandise will be in a locked case requiring an employee to get items at a customer's request. The customer is either required to purchase the merchandise immediately or it is left at the checkout area for the customer to purchase when finishing shopping. This prevents the customer from having a chance to conceal the item.

Another formed of locked merchandise is especially popular with liquor. A secure, store- administered hard-plastic cap is placed on the regular bottle top that cannot be removed without a store key. Once it is purchased the clerk will remove it, otherwise the shoplifter must struggle to open the bottle as the cap is designed to be extremely difficult to remove.

[Boonanza]

Originally Posted by Oswald2001 ↗

Originally Posted by happy

I know exactly where that store is. It is a high crime area and is getting worse.

Napalm.

Napalm the whole place.

[Oswald2001]

There were plenty of Nazis that lived to be quite old and always defended their twisted exploits.

There are plenty of Useful Idiots defending the Moo Slum Dark Ages Death CULT terrorists.

There are plenty of apologists for Criminal Ghetto Trash Urban Terrorists.

Strange, but that's Life.

[Kanda444]

im going to try to answer this in parts....

Originally Posted by WinglessAngel ↗

I have to completely disagree with your comment in its' entirety.

It was estimated in 2001 (that's a long time ago so inflate these numbers) that the cost to US merchants, as a result of shoplifting, was 25 MILLION DOLLARS PER DAY. All the top suits of all the corporations combined can't 'plan' for that kind of loss.

They absolutely do plan for it. i've set the budget for a box store before and we most definitely factor shoplifting in. that's not an assumption that stores plan for shoplifting, it's a fact. the only type of stores that dont are small mom and pop type stores....

I'd LOVE to see what you'd do if you caught someone stealing from a store you owned. Say you opened a big old Bong shop, poured every cent of your earnings into it, spent years struggling to turn your investment into a profit and some stupid, mindless, arrogant punk or bitch walks up and just TAKES your shit ...what would you do Kanda?
He's just fucking with you now and you know you've lost tens of thousands of dollars to other shoplifters, now this guy is in his car and you're still trying to protect your stuff because it's what you do for a living. What are you going to do Kanda? You're gonna just wave BuhBye and blow him a kiss? I didn't think so.

you're kinda comparing apple and oranges there....if i had a bong shop, it would be impossible for somebody to steal thousands from it, logistically speaking where as Walmart is a huge multimillion dollar corporation.... but i get what you're saying and yes i would let them leave and just get a plate number. would i be happy about that outcome? fuck no i wouldnt....but i wouldnt know if a shoplifter is packing a gun or not and my life is not worth a petty property crime. that's what it is, petty theft. if a company neglects to factor in shoplifting into it budgeted loss then that's their own fault. small businesses dont have a lot of room (if any) for shoplifting so it definitely affects them more but they still have to factor it in or it's their loss. that's just part of owning and running a retail establishment, the same way my wife's bank estimates their losses from balancing errors of tellers and losses from fraud. all of that is factored in at the beginning of the year when the company does it's budget and earnings projections.

when i worked at a local grocery store when i was a teen, a man came in and grabbed a case of beer and ran out the door. my manager chased after him and followed him into the parking lot. when the men got to the parking lot, the man with the beer turned at fired 4 shots at our store....he was shooting over his shoulder and only hit the store, thank god. as he was running, the manager continued to chase the thief....the shoplifter's friend pulled around with a car but paniced when he saw a store employee and hit the gas, hitting both the shoplifter and the manager. my manager was severely injured and was forced to retire and collect disability.

now, the grocery store has to pay L&I for their workers reckless actions. that costs them a lot more then a case of beer and it costs the tax payers even more as they now have to support this guy for the rest of his life.

shoplifting is a property crime. it's not worth a person's life....and if you feel it is then, im sorry but that kinda makes you a greedy and dangerous person. i believe in the Castle Law...that your home is your castle and you should be able to protect yourself and your property with deadly force..in that sense, i am a dangerous person in my home. i do not believe in harming somebody for stealing product. i dont know their situations, how bad they are struggling, why they cant find work...but i do know they dont and i dont deserve to die or get hurt because they shoplifted.

The following are just a few things that we, as consumers, pay for to prevent punk ass bitches like that dead chick from taking shit because they feel they are entitled to it (even if it's your shit Kanda).

my loss prevention group ended up well below our scheduled budget the first year i was there....what that means is we didnt have as much shoplifting as we had budgeted for. where do you think that money went? to lowering prices for consumers? absolutely not....it went to me and my coworkers. the price you pay is effected by the market, not shoplifting, unless you are talking about a mom and pop store. if you were talking about Walmart (which we are), you could stop all shoplifting there and you would still pay the same prices you are now.

--------------------------
Anti-shoplifting options

Closed circuit television
CCTV monitoring is an important anti shoplifting method. Retailers focused on loss prevention often devote most of their resources to this technology.

Electronic article surveillance
Electronic article surveillance is second only to CCTV in popularity amongst retailers looking for inventory protection. EAS refers to the security tags that attach to a garment and cause an alarm to sound when removed from the store.

Phony shoppers
Loss Prevention personnel will patrol the store acting as if they are real shoppers. They may try on merchandise and browse the racks, all the while looking for signs of shoplifting and looking for possible shoplifters. Many large retail companies utilize this technique, and will watch a shoplifter conceal an item then stop them after they have exited the store.

Uniformed guards
Mostly used by high end retail establishments. The presence of a uniformed guard acts as a deterrent to shoplifting activity.

Exit inspections
Costco shoppers are familiar with this. No shopping cart gets out the door until its contents are compared against the register tape. In most of the US, however, shoppers are under no obligation to accede to a search unless the employee has reasonable grounds to suspect shoplifting. All retail employees are instructed not to block the exit in the face of a customer determined to leave without showing the receipt.

Close customer service
Floor attendants are instructed to greet, follow, and offer help with their shopping. Shoplifters are not comfortable with this attention and will go somewhere else where they can work unnoticed.

BOB mirrors
Bottom of basket mirrors are commonly used in grocery stores where the check out lanes are close together and the cashier might be unable to see the entire basket to ensure there are no items being unpaid for.

Locked merchandise
Some merchandise will be in a locked case requiring an employee to get items at a customer's request. The customer is either required to purchase the merchandise immediately or it is left at the checkout area for the customer to purchase when finishing shopping. This prevents the customer from having a chance to conceal the item.

Another formed of locked merchandise is especially popular with liquor. A secure, store- administered hard-plastic cap is placed on the regular bottle top that cannot be removed without a store key. Once it is purchased the clerk will remove it, otherwise the shoplifter must struggle to open the bottle as the cap is designed to be extremely difficult to remove.

yes, i understand all of the options. i worked in LP before. i was trained to stop shoplifters and have....and im telling you that every loss prevention officer i've ever met would tell you the same thing i just said....that it's an expected crime (if it wasnt expected and planned for, why do you think they would try to minimize it) and it's not worth a person's life. had i chased a person out the door for shoplifting, i would have been fired. no joke..... it was store policy. so, explain to me why businesses themselves put those kind of policies in place, yet this guy was in the right for violating that policy and ending a life...over property?

if a shoplifter get caught in the store and detained, then fine. good for LP....if the shoplifter runs and exits before LP can stop them, there is protocol to follow and it doesn't include pursuing the suspect to the car and shooting them if they try to leave.