[Faust]

Originally Posted by William May ↗

WonderMomma, I could not agree MORE. This ENTIRE WAR is the fault of the Russians. EVERY SINGLE ATROCITY should be recorded and available. NOTHING should be hidden. The Russians should face ALL the evidence of what they have done, with no chance of denial.
If you start hiding stuff because it's unpleasant, you devalue the lives of the victims of this war.
Why do you think the Allied governments filmed and photographed the Holocaust sites as they were found? It wasn't for entertainment purposes. It was so it could NEVER be denied or hidden.

Strong WORDS. Much of the dead children footage that I have was recorded in Ukraine prior to 2022. More specifically, eastern Ukraine. Often those videos are reposted now, with the shelling being claimed to have happened during 2022 and people getting real worked up about it, now. Bellingcat understandably stopped trying to geolocate the aftermath of the shelling as it would implicate their allies.

My point is: your opinion does not apply to all dead kids. You do not want “ EVERY SINGLE ATROCITY” recorded or documented at all, so how much value is there really in you only caring about a specific subset of children or atrocities?

[kellyhound]

Originally Posted by Roosta ↗

POINT TO BE RAISED FOR ALL !

Don't we have enough death in front of us with combatants & war related stuff that we can be informed about without bringing kids into it as I don't think that it's necessary to give full explicit accounts of what happens to them, visual imagery or written media serves no purpose, intel wise or other, as we know that it happens, but IMO, I think that it sickens the hardest individual & should be made into a separate thread if ppl want to go there & on that basis I respectfully ask that even though this is Documenting Reality in its purest form I'm still of the opinion that war related children & civilians vids & media be made into another thread.
This has happened a couple of times now by a few dif posters & I for one need to say something as War Related should be just that, with dif sections that we have, only also have a ''Casualties of War'' section where it's more defined so that one doesn't stumble across unwanted or should I say, ''extremely concerning material'' as war can fuck a lot of shit up yes, but I would like to think that most of us don't really want or need to hear about kids & that, in a generalized thread, so let's start another thread, ''Casualties of War'' for this kind of stuff PLZ !

Just my opinion, but a valid one !

There are enough seperate threads already in the war section and dead kids posts getting moved/posted in another section so injured kids or as in this case kids climbing out from the rubble is fine and when people don't want to see any kids at all they can skip the vid based on the description given by the poster.

[kellyhound]

The Russian oligarch, former owner of the largest developer group Don-Stroi, Dmitriy Zelenov, has died in France, after “accidentally” falling down the stairs. He was against Putin’s war.

It is the latest in a long line of examples of mysterious deaths among Putin’s oligarchs. Pavel Pchelnikov, 52, was a manager of the Russian railways and was found dead in his Moscow apartment; the same fate for Konstantin Goloshchapov’s son, Dmitry, four days after his father fled to Belarus (Putin frequented Goloshchapov’s massage parlor in a St. Petersburg sauna and was close to the exiled tycoon, “nicknamed the ‘masseur’ of Tsar».

In July, Gazprom’s transport director, 61-year-old Yuri Voronov, was found dead in a swimming pool; billionaire Alexander Subbotin, 43, died mysteriously in May: probably the manager of Lukoil was poisoned with toad venom; Ukrainian multimillionaire Yevgeny Palant, 47, and his wife Olga Palant, 50, were found stabbed to death in their family home in the Moscow region.

The list is actually much more extensive, since the beginning of the year many of Putin’s friends have died in circumstances that are yet to be clarified.

And at the root of these incredible series of deaths is, according to Browder, an internal struggle to divide up what remains of the pie now that the economy is in recession due to Putin’s war.

[WhiskeyOutpost]

Originally Posted by Faust ↗

Strong WORDS. Much of the dead children footage that I have was recorded in Ukraine prior to 2022. More specifically, eastern Ukraine.

Another one of your feeble lies to support whatever point you're trying to make.

As for what Roosta said, I can understand but to separate the "children" stuff is to do them a disservice IMO. It's all war and the effects of it, and all need to be aware. This isn't really the place to "hide" stuff with things like trigger warnings because it's more distasteful than other stuff.

[WonderMomma]

Eurovision contestant KRUT sang "Koliskova" on Khreshchatyk (Kyiv). Despite the rain, people gathered to listen to the performer. Someone sang along, someone cried, and someone just listened.

[Roosta]

I fully understand what you're trying to say & it's still of my opinion that there needs to be a separate thread or warning prior to the post & reasons being are,
I am in no way trying to separate or detract from the fact that this happens, nor am I doing a disservice to their memories, quite the opposite, I'm also suggesting, if you read between the lines, that it's more centralized & not lost in all the ordinary warfare activities & also creates a one stop reference shop for war crimes against Uk civies ect, so it all depends on your terminology of what I have written, doesn't it, as a different thread is in no way taking their memories away is it ? As to the, "There's already enough threads about the war," Is there, or are we just getting lazy ?
If anything, you are burying their memories, if you think about it like that, burying them under the fog of normal warfare, between combatants, if you like & no one really goes back in time to sift through hundreds upon hundreds of posts to find that particular bit of intel right, so as you can now probably see what I'm talking about, if you put it in that sense, your actually burying their memories if nothing else & it all depends how you look at it I guess.
I suppose we can agree to disagree BUT my stance in firm on this as it's not hard to open with "WARNING, CHILD & CIVILIAN RELATED MATERIAL" is it, then those of us who want to CHOOSE to scroll past that post have the option to do so. What's so hard about that, matter o fact, WM just did it in the Daily War Section to which I for one, am grateful that I was given a choice not to be subjected to hearing about it even though I & we all know that it happens.
It's like changing the TV Channel when something comes on that we don't want to hear about, click it's gone, simple as that & in no way does it mean that we forget their existence, on the contrary.
Make of it what you will, you have your opinions & I have mine & having lost a son myself at a very young age I for one know firsthand the trauma one must feel when we stumble across a topic that's close to our heart without any warning whatsoever.
Our children are our future & will never ever be forgotten !

[WonderMomma]

Originally Posted by Roosta ↗

as a different thread is in no way taking their memories away is it ? As to the, "There's already enough threads about the war," Is there, or are we just getting lazy ?

Easy to say when you don't spend hours a day scouring Telegram and Twitter, translating, deciphering, investigating, tracking, downloading, copy pasting, uploading, trying to keep track of what media, subject, etc. goes where. I'm not criticizing you at all for this... I just think if you were one of the people posting stuff every day, you'd know we're not being lazy.

I think if the Russia/Ukraine war had it's own subforum it would be more feasible to divide things up into their own categories... but we will just have to continue to work with what we have available to us.

I completely understand your concerns Roosta, and as such will do my best to respect them and provide a quick warning, as I did earlier, on anything having to do with civilians. Hopefully this will help.

[kellyhound]

Originally Posted by Roosta ↗

I fully understand what you're trying to say & it's still of my opinion that there needs to be a separate thread or warning prior to the post.

if you read between the lines, that it's more centralized & not lost in all the ordinary warfare activities.

I suppose we can agree to disagree BUT my stance in firm on this as it's not hard to open with "WARNING, CHILD & CIVILIAN RELATED MATERIAL" is it, then those of us who want to CHOOSE to scroll past that post have the option to do so.

Make of it what you will, you have your opinions & I have mine & having lost a son myself at a very young age I for one know firsthand the trauma one must feel when we stumble across a topic that's close to our heart without any warning whatsoever.

Sorry for your loss.

I understand and like i said, based on the description, like WM did. When others don't put a warning in the description members can report it so a mod can add a warning in the description when it involves kids or, when they're deceased, mods can move it to another section and hand out a warning.

It's hard not to include dead/wounded or normal adult civilians in the war thread as soldiers are civilians also and loads didn't choose to fight.

I updated the description in the war thread.
Also don't post images of dead kids in here. When the post involves, injured, children please put a child warning in your description.

On the other hand this is not youtube.

[Eggs&Spam]

Originally Posted by WhiskeyOutpost ↗

No. Poor comparison comparing Zelenskiy to those guys.

And also, no. The "Nazis" hold very little if no power in Ukrainian politics. Not sure what you're reading. The only reason why these couple brigades are allowed to exist is because they're good experienced fighters.



You're late to the show and a dollar short.

They already destroyed the place, and corporations/people/politicians profiting from war has literally been a thing as old as humanity. That doesn't mean we shouldn't help a country that was wrongly invaded. The fact that people profit from war matters little. Maybe Russia shouldn't have attempted to install a puppet and later invaded when he got thrown out

Those fascists literally got him into power with the help of Western sponsorship. If you knew anything about the history of Ukraine, you'll realize such a thing is not only possible but probable. And thank you for proving my point that this is \\yet another\\ spending spree by industrialists and bad faith politicians who should know better. You say the place is destroyed. Who's going to rebuild it and continue arming it up and keeping the war going? The only people who suffer are the Ukrainians. I'm young but old enough to have seen this movie too many times over the past 20 years to know this is a shitty situation that didn't need to be escalated by both the West (primarily the US) and Russia.

Originally Posted by WonderMomma ↗

^ what he said and...
Comparing Zelenskyy to Hussein and Gadaffi?

He's no different than those dictators if we're talking about Western nations sponsoring them, then discarding them once they outlive their usefulness. There's been many examples of this over the last couple of decades, and you're a chump if you believe this is going to be any different. Based on what I've seen, I wouldn't say dissolving your political opposition and shutting down news publications are great examples of democracy in a country that's been castigated as Russia-lite for many years until the invasion happened. But I am told the Zelensky government is a pillar of democracy. He even got his face on the cover of Time magazine (as they did Hitler, they seem keen on fascists--real ones Jon Stewart gives awards to at Disneyworld

There's a saying: don't piss on my back and tell me it's raining, because it's just piss.

[WhiskeyOutpost]

Originally Posted by Eggs&Spam ↗

Those fascists literally got him into power with the help of Western sponsorship. If you knew anything about the history of Ukraine, you'll realize such a thing is not only possible but probable. And thank you for proving my point that this is \\yet another\\ spending spree by industrialists and bad faith politicians who should know better. You say the place is destroyed. Who's going to rebuild it and continue arming it up and keeping the war going? The only people who suffer are the Ukrainians. I'm young but old enough to have seen this movie too many times over the past 20 years to know this is a shitty situation that didn't need to be escalated by both the West (primarily the US) and Russia.

He's no different than those dictators if we're talking about Western nations sponsoring them, then discarding them once they outlive their usefulness. There's been many examples of this over the last couple of decades, and you're a chump if you believe this is going to be any different. Based on what I've seen, I wouldn't say dissolving your political opposition and shutting down news publications are great examples of democracy in a country that's been castigated as Russia-lite for many years until the invasion happened. But I am told the Zelensky government is a pillar of democracy. He even got his face on the cover of Time magazine (as they did Hitler, they seem keen on fascists--real ones Jon Stewart gives awards to at Disneyworld

There's a saying: don't piss on my back and tell me it's raining, because it's just piss.

"If you knew anything about Ukraine" - that's a common phrase from pro-Putin idiots on here, almost all of which are now banned.

You had a couple points in there besides the obvious falsehoods such as still comparing Zelenskiy to actual awful dictators. Wrong. You've been listening to some real shitty sources. Might want to check that out. Compare what you're saying with actual Kremlin/Russian govt talking points and you'll see that they're really similar. Go ahead and compare them, the resemblance is striking. "Nazism" is just used as a pejorative to emotionally rally the Russian people with what happened during WW2, what they call "the great patriotic war". Putin wouldn't pull a hair for "Nazis".