[Billthegravedigger]

Originally Posted by synthninja ↗

I think there was a man from Dundee yea. I'll have to check up and see how many Scots we lost...

If you lost people then I'm sorry. I can understand you wanting to forget it. This site isn't gonna help with forgetting it I don't think.

Now see ? That was respect man. Thank you for that. I am a cinical asshole at times, I admitt that. But at the same time, I would not wish death on ANYONE.

There were around 140 nations that lost their citizens on 9/11. Black, white, Mexican, Russian, Chinese, Japanese. All walks of life, all colors. It did not matter where they were from, they were human beings that had the right to live until they died of natural causes.

They were MURDERED, plain and simple. I do not get the conspiracies people. At first, I bought into it, then I started to do research. I saw at least 30 people jump from the North Tower. Imagine going to see a friend you had not seen in at least a couple of years.

You get there, and are waiting on him to come down and show you the sights and sounds. Out of fucking nowhere, you hear sounds that you will never forget, and you see things you will never forget, no matter how bad it fucks your head up.

When a black person hit the concrete, they exploded just like a white person, and like a Chinese person, and just like a Japanese person. They hit the ground and went flying in all directions. An arm here, a leg there. Eyeballs popped out of a poor black man's head and hit the glass windows next to the plaza, and slid down the glass. A female NYPD officer almost had a mental breakdown right there.

Several people did have mental breakdowns. I tryed to find my friend, but he was trapped above the plane impact. He could have been one of the people I saw die from 1,200 feet in the air.

Those buildings were groaning and creaking well before they came down, you could feel them shudder as they tryed to remain upright. I made it out when so many others did not. That is why I get tore up about this shit. It's personal. Witness what I witnessed, bottle it up in the back of your mind. Dream of falling and hitting the ground, over and over and over and over.

It will affect you right down into your core. It will change you. The question is, how do you let it affect you ? I tried the constructive path. That is why I have reseached this from every angle. Like it or not, the planes United 175, and AA 11 and fires brought the towers down, and AA 77 hit the pentagon, and passengers brought down United 93.

Isn't that a conspiracy enough right there ? 19 crazy fuckers got one over on the big bad U.S. of A. ? And our "goverment" knew it was coming, but did not stop it. Think about it folks.

[Billthegravedigger]

BBKF, I would rather you take 5 pages to speak your mind than say nothing at all. That goes for everyone. But it pisses me off when people are condescending and act like they know it all. And you know what ? I bet NONE of them were even there that day.

[synthninja]

Originally Posted by BBKF ↗

"If you lost people then I'm sorry. I can understand you wanting to forget it. This site isn't gonna help with forgetting it I don't think."

Now that we do agree on! No it won't, especially since I get so mad at "armchair physicists and engineers." I know about discrimination of the muslim people as I worked for AA before and then much later than 9/11. At first it was horrible. Trying to be kind... I guess many had a "knee jerk reaction" to the tragedy. It wasn't fair and still isn't as I don't believe it has gotten a whole lot better. The US has never suffered a monumental terrorist act of this magnitude. We thought it wouldn't happen to us. We trusted the government agencies were sharing important information to keep us protected. We were wrong. Then to see a group of people on television cheering. I mean effing cheering that our friends and loved ones were maimed. That picture will not leave my mind. They weren't terrorists. They were just people...children...jumping up and down and laughing and clapping and screaming for joy. I think that didn't help the already rampant discrimination. But we know who the terrorists were and it just boggles my mind that people actually think that our government staged this. I don't think many could hate Bush as much as me, but I just don't see it. I am educated, my son is a physicist and engineer. His father is an engineer. It feels like a slap in the face every time someone tries to make this into something other than what is was. I feel insulted not only for me, but my friends and Bill's friend and everyone who lost people. The people in the planes, the 911 calls from dying people. Yes...I am traumatized as most of us probably still are years later. The sound of a jet flying over, the sound of sirens...and I was just a television viewer, can you possibly imagine how Bill feels after being there and hearing and feeling the bodies hit and explode....didn't mean to go on and on.

My whole entire point was that sometimes information can be very dangerous to our safety if released and gave the OBL military operation as an example of the danger of some leaks. Some discretion is needed at times so the wrong people do not get the info.CNN is a terrorists best friend. Sorry so long.

I can understand the slap in the face feeling...

Did you know some of the hijackers on those planes have been found alive? I think we can all feel suitably slapped in the face. Protected? no. -- America wants war.

Apparently the FBI had people in custody before the event, admitting to planning it.

Bill doesn't do himself any favours with his terrible temper. On every oppurtunity he flies off the handle and just goes careering across the room swearing and ranting. He reminds me of that Tazmanian Devil cartoon character, only uglier!

[BBKF]

Originally Posted by Billthegravedigger ↗

BBKF, I would rather you take 5 pages to speak your mind than say nothing at all. That goes for everyone. But it pisses me off when people are condescending and act like they know it all. And you know what ? I bet NONE of them were even there that day.

I have always wondered how many people were truly traumatized by this. It was graphic television footage (at first). In some of your videos I hear women saying "Please, take the children home" or "Don't let your kids see this". There must have been mothers with children just watching and waiting for what would happen next. Plus it was played over and over.

There could be a lot of issues caused that no one is even aware of. Across the world people were watching.

[Billthegravedigger]

I agree with you on everything but the highjackers being found alive. They were on those planes, and they did not survive. Do you believe everything you are told ? Or that you read ? That is why I am so cinical man, people will feed you the biggest line of bullshit there is. Those guys are dead. "Plane and simple".

[BBKF]

Originally Posted by synthninja ↗

I can understand the slap in the face feeling...

Did you know some of the hijackers on those planes have been found alive? I think we can all feel suitably slapped in the face. Protected? no. -- America wants war.

Apparently the FBI had people in custody before the event, admitting to planning it.

Bill doesn't do himself any favours with his terrible temper. On every oppurtunity he flies off the handle and just goes careering across the room swearing and ranting. He reminds me of that Tazmanian Devil cartoon character, only uglier!

I didn't know any terrorists that had actually been on the aircrafts that crashed had been found alive.

I did know the FBI had information before hand and didn't share it. The big tug of war between the different government agencies. The CIA hates the FBI who hates the CIA who hates the secret service who....it goes on and on....

But no..I did not hear of them being found alive and I would have to have proof of this.

[synthninja]

I don't believe everything I'm told. That's just it.

They want war, and they are not out to protect you, don't think that for one minute. They want whatever is best for them, money driven as usual, obviously. But they want all of the cake. ie global domination.

Now as much truth as we can inject into the situation is as far as I'm concerned, better. Because things are not looking good. They used the terrorist shit to put up cameras everywhere and invade our privacy. At the same time giving them the war they wanted.

The good world that used to exist.....well it's ceasing to exist. People are becoming less free. Exactly the opposite of what America is supposed to stand for.

[Billthegravedigger]

Originally Posted by BBKF ↗

I have always wondered how many people were truly traumatized by this. It was graphic television footage (at first). In some of your videos I hear women saying "Please, take the children home" or "Don't let your kids see this". There must have been mothers with children just watching and waiting for what would happen next. Plus it was played over and over.

There could be a lot of issues caused that no one is even aware of. Across the world people were watching.

I have heard so many people say the planes hitting the towers was graphic. To some I guess it was. If they had seen all of those people hit the ground and atomize their blood and explode all over the place, they would be seriously fucked up.

Bodies from around the impact area would come down, and though they were already dead, it did not make it any less horrible.

[BBKF]

Originally Posted by synthninja ↗

I don't believe everything I'm told. That's just it.

They want war, and they are not out to protect you, don't think that for one minute. They want whatever is best for them, money driven as usual, obviously. But they want all of the cake. ie global domination.

Now as much truth as we can inject into the situation is as far as I'm concerned, better. Because things are not looking good. They used the terrorist shit to put up cameras everywhere and invade our privacy. At the same time giving them the war they wanted.

The good world that used to exist.....well it's ceasing to exist. People are becoming less free. Exactly the opposite of what America is supposed to stand for.

Don't get me started on Bushs' "Patriot Act". I am half afraid to look info up on the internet that doesn't have the inappropriate warning words that then gives them the right to tap my phone.

I also agree we have lost many of our civil liberties, but that is not 9/11. That is Bush using 9/11 for his own personal gain. Many politicians are using 9/11 for political gain. Guiliani (sp) for instance. Bush used 9/11 to get us into Iraq. That does not take away the fact that 9/11 did happen and it was terrorists who hijacked those planes into the buildings. They found some of the plans at OBL's compound when they invaded. I am not a government sheep by any means.

[Billthegravedigger]

Originally Posted by synthninja ↗

I don't believe everything I'm told. That's just it.

They want war, and they are not out to protect you, don't think that for one minute. They want whatever is best for them, money driven as usual, obviously. But they want all of the cake. ie global domination.

Now as much truth as we can inject into the situation is as far as I'm concerned, better. Because things are not looking good. They used the terrorist shit to put up cameras everywhere and invade our privacy. At the same time giving them the war they wanted.

The good world that used to exist.....well it's ceasing to exist. People are becoming less free. Exactly the opposite of what America is supposed to stand for.

Ok man, why can't you see I agree with you that our goverment did not stop it. They knew it was coming. It happened, they DID NOT stop it. That we agree on. But the planes and fires brought the towers down. A plane hit the pentagon, and a plane was brought down by the passengers that day.

I agree with you that they did not stop it, but why do you insist on crazy shit ? The highjackers are still alive ? That is like saying a suicide bomber that blows him self to shit survived it. It makes no sense.