[el_topo]

Originally Posted by Aries85 ↗

Who gave these fabricated entities the right to control your choices? The whole system is evil wrong and corrupt, even already enslaving yet to be born childrens lives, disgusting.

I hope humanity decides to finally shut down governmets rulers and banksters etc and reclaims their true birthrights born equally upon this earth we all share. No one higher or has more power or authority than anyone no matter what invented costume they wear.

That costume also comes with a weapon

[b0g]

also a currently smoking hot event:

[tman3832]

Originally Posted by RealityUnfolding ↗

Well, I'm tired of dude bros throwing up all over the place after drinking, dumbasses not getting their cars taken care of and dropping oil everywhere, morons spitting lugies out their car windows, assholes who don't clean up after their pets, bloody needles in the park and yadda yadda. Life sucks.

People do stupid shit that annoys other people. Get over it. Don't want to deal with apartment living? Save and get a house. Have a job that lets smokers all over? Get a different job. Find an employer who voluntarily bans it.

Their choice to smoke, YOUR choice to endure it. And FFS, stop with the drama queen BS that there's this mass collective all smoking in the streets ready to stalk you like fucking zombies.

As a smoker who has carried a dead butt for a mile to dispose of it, who bought a house to avoid pissing off neighbors, there are jackasses among us. But we are not responsible for ensuring your happy at the cost of ours and there are jackasses among any population.

I LIKE to smoke. Yes, it's stupid. But it's MY choice to be stupid. I should pay higher insurance premiums, I should abide by individual establishments requests. I like waking up, having coffee and blackening my lungs. When my family stresses me, I like the solace and comfort a cig provides. (And incidentally, it reduces the risk of breast cancer, especially after menopause, so there's that.)

We get it, you're a whiner who wants everyone else to kotow and want everyone around to serve you.

We get it, you consider yourself one of the considerate ones. Power to you, I have nothing against that. In public though, smoking is bullshit and still way too widespread to be acceptable.

Just smoking doesn't compare to anything you listed there. It can fuck up the health of everyone around you, and often is disruptive in very powerful ways. Like the ones I listed. It's not like a bro puking in the street, it's every day, everywhere you go. Even when you take steps to avoid it, people still think it's only about their bodies. The culture around smoking is often "I have the choice to put it in my body" yeah well at the expense of others too, you're making people deal with it too. Especially when people have no choice but to endure it, like me. Maybe you should just find another habit, endure the discomfort? Like I have to live with my discomfort of you feeling better. That's what you're telling me to do.

Other people should sacrifice their health and well being because it's a smoker's choice and right to apparently.

On another note, your premium isn't the only one you impact. You may pay a higher premium, but the more smokers who rack up medical bills, the higher the premiums for others go too. So we're paying for you too. Thanks. Although, that argument from me can be flawed, we all have our vices and poor health decisions, we all contribute to the shit show that is health care.

I get it, hell drinking Coca Cola is my vice. To make the cans and the drink, pollutes the air like crazy sure.

But smoking man, it's such cancer, the culture around it is so much more selfish.

There's nothing wrong with upping the minimum age, just get people away from this. (Doesn't seem to be my main argument here, sorry that I'm trailing off)

I grew up with a smoking mother, breathed that shit every day. I grew up not having the choice. When I go home to visit family, I still don't have that choice. I finally moved out and got away from that shit for a while it was nice. I even sucked it up when I moved in with friends to save money, they smoked, but they smoked outside. Yeah I had to keep windows closed on a hot summer day, but it was fine, I was grateful for the attempt, but still annoyed I couldn't even recirculate the air in my bedroom at the expense of their constant smoking. Then we had a falling out for other reasons, and when I got as far away from smokers as I could, my health increased exponentially.

The thing that pisses me off is even when you go somewhere and make every attempt possible to let people exercise their right to smoke, even move into a non smoking area, buy a house, whatever, people still have the nerve to smoke in ways they shouldn't that impacts you. Then they complain saying "Well it's my body" when you challenge them. No, it's also my body too, and I have the right to not feel like shit.

I could buy a house, but my neighbor might smoke in their backyard and fill my house with smoke too. Or what if you can't afford to buy a house because the limited jobs you have to choose from are in a location where housing prices are in a boom, and you're out of the loop.

I like the solace and comfort of air not clouded with cigarette smoke, with a room not soaked in a smokey smell on a nice spring day, but I don't get that choice. I have to pander to YOU, because YOU have more of a right to smoke than I do to that. Why am I a whiner because of it?

Not sure what my argument is here, you're right, life is tough and there's a lot of shit to get over. I'm just venting anger around the topic because people for some reason think it's too heavy handed preventing anyone under 21 from buying tobacco products. Fuck that, the next generation doesn't need this. If you're over 21, the fuck do you care?

But smoking, it's a selfish habit because it always impacts the people around you severely. And these people don't have a choice.

BUT YOU DO HAVE A CHOICE. Because apparently you're entitled to that choice, and us non-smokers aren't, we're just all whiners who have to deal with you.

That's a fucked up culture.

[Karma]

I gave up smoking after 14 years. It was the hardest thing I’ve ever done. Withdrawal symptoms etc. But after my 5th attempt over a few years I succeeded.
It was MY choice. If my government had tried to force me to stop, with scare tactics, ridiculous pricing, “graphic “ photos on cig packs it would not have made me stop.
Freedom of choice. No one has the right to force someone else to do something. You choose to make the wrong choice, whatever it is, you pay the consequences.
I avoid smoking areas. I don’t look down on smokers. CHOICE = FREEDOM.
Now, if you were to blow smoke in my face etc, ALL bets are off. Don’t mess with me and I don’t mess with you.

If 18 is old enough to fight for your country then you’re old enough to smoke and drink.

[smccarthy945]

I don't think the govt should have the right to tell you what you can or cannot put in your own body including smoking. Let's say you and I were the only two people alive on earth - what would give me the right to tell you what you cannot eat, smoke, take etc? So why should the govt have this right?

Portugal had a huge drug problem in the 90s and they decided to decriminalize everything and move all the money from incarceration to education and rehabilitation. It took the stigma away from drug use ect and people were not afraid to ask for help anymore.

Now there are practically NO overdose deaths in Portugal now and drug use a WAY down. All the detractors screamed that Portugal would become a drug users mecca but the opposite happened.

Don't believe me just google "Portugal decriminalization success" or read the article below:

https://time.com/longform/portugal-d...iminalization/

When you make people responsible for their own actions and make something legal and not "tabu" people don't want it anymore. Same thing happened when alcohol was under prohibition. Everyone wanted it and an entire illegal market was formed to provide it.

The same thing is happening with the cartels with drugs. There is a demand and tons of profits to be made so the cartels simply provide the same as the mob did during prohibition.

This war is absolutely useless. Drug use rates and deaths continue to climb along with overdose deaths because people don't know what they are buying and are afraid to get locked up and their lives ruined.

The idea of "Well people shouldn't use drugs" is as stupid as saying "People shouldn't have sex" if they don't want to get pregnant. It's a stupid unrealistic idea.

Of course drugs are bad and addiction is terrible but what we are doing right now isn't working and the few countries who have taken money and shifted it from criminalization to prevention and treatment have had unbelievable success.

The bottom line is that people have been using drugs since the beginning of time and it's not going to miraculously stop anytime soon. We can either let the govt keep doing the same stupid "war on drugs" strategy or we can demand decriminalization and treat drug use as a health problem and not a "war".

I don't know how you declare war on your uncles, aunts, cousins, mothers, fathers, etc when they have a health problem such as addition. Hey Dad, I am sorry you are addicted to cocaine so we are going to have to go to war with you so strap up and get ready for a battle! Instead of saying "Dad I know you have an addition problem and there is help available without the risk of you getting a felony and ruining your entire life b/c you are unemployable for the rest of your life".

People hide in the shadows because they don't want to get a felony that will cause they to be unemployable for the rest of their lives which in turn causes people not to seek the help they need or overdose from drugs b/c of the same reasons.

We need to demand that this "war" stops and drugs are decriminalized so it can be treated as a health issue instead of a "war" on our own families and friends.

[el_topo]

Originally Posted by smccarthy945 ↗

I don't think the govt should have the right to tell you what you can or cannot put in your own body including smoking. Let's say you and I were the only two people alive on earth - what would give me the right to tell you what you cannot eat, smoke, take etc? So why should the govt have this right?

Portugal had a huge drug problem in the 90s and they decided to decriminalize everything and move all the money from incarceration to education and rehabilitation. It took the stigma away from drug use ect and people were not afraid to ask for help anymore.

Now there are practically NO overdose deaths in Portugal now and drug use a WAY down. All the detractors screamed that Portugal would become a drug users mecca but the opposite happened.

Don't believe me just google "Portugal decriminalization success" or read the article below:

https://time.com/longform/portugal-d...iminalization/

When you make people responsible for their own actions and make something legal and not "tabu" people don't want it anymore. Same thing happened when alcohol was under prohibition. Everyone wanted it and an entire illegal market was formed to provide it.

The same thing is happening with the cartels with drugs. There is a demand and tons of profits to be made so the cartels simply provide the same as the mob did during prohibition.

This war is absolutely useless. Drug use rates and deaths continue to climb along with overdose deaths because people don't know what they are buying and are afraid to get locked up and their lives ruined.

The idea of "Well people shouldn't use drugs" is as stupid as saying "People shouldn't have sex" if they don't want to get pregnant. It's a stupid unrealistic idea.

Of course drugs are bad and addiction is terrible but what we are doing right now isn't working and the few countries who have taken money and shifted it from criminalization to prevention and treatment have had unbelievable success.

The bottom line is that people have been using drugs since the beginning of time and it's not going to miraculously stop anytime soon. We can either let the govt keep doing the same stupid "war on drugs" strategy or we can demand decriminalization and treat drug use as a health problem and not a "war".

I don't know how you declare war on your uncles, aunts, cousins, mothers, fathers, etc when they have a health problem such as addition. Hey Dad, I am sorry you are addicted to cocaine so we are going to have to go to war with you so strap up and get ready for a battle! Instead of saying "Dad I know you have an addition problem and there is help available without the risk of you getting a felony and ruining your entire life b/c you are unemployable for the rest of your life".

People hide in the shadows because they don't want to get a felony that will cause they to be unemployable for the rest of their lives which in turn causes people not to seek the help they need or overdose from drugs b/c of the same reasons.

We need to demand that this "war" stops and drugs are decriminalized so it can be treated as a health issue instead of a "war" on our own families and friends.

Yea that’s the oldest debate against the drug war. Unfortunately law enforcement has kids they plan on sending off to college. If they make drugs legal then there won’t be anyone to arrest. Sounds fucked up but it’s true. It’s the only reason they haven’t made drugs legal, cuz it keeps them busy and the user at the bottom

[flyflicker123]

its tobacco...who cares

[niknik]

Originally Posted by tman3832 ↗

I'm just going to add, it's more complicated than that. At least in my view, I'm disgusted by smoking. Here's a triggered rant.

Everyone says "Oh we should have a choice to smoke!" Well fuck you, people who don't smoke have to deal with your bullshit everywhere we go.

Want to open your window on a nice spring day in a "Smoke free" apartment complex? WELL FUCK YOU, the person downstairs is smoking on their balcony filling your apartment with cigarette smoke.

You're at work just doing your thing, WELL FUCK YOU, someone's smoking next to the intake vent like a stupid ass hole and now you have to inhale their shitty life choices.

You walk up the hill from the designated smoking area trying to get you your car, FUCK YOU the wind carries this shit up to you.

You're trying to watch a soccer game and someone's smoking just outside the fence behind you, and you're down wind, FUCK YOU.

You go home to visit your mom for Christmas? WELL FUCK YOU, you are now a cloud of cigarette smoke because that shit is all over you and your clothes and anything in your suitcase. You fly home and now EVERYTHING in that case is just a smoke stench.

You want to walk down the street? WELL FUCK YOU, cigarette butts EVERYWHERE, in the gutter, under your car hood, on the grass. The person in front of you walking is smoking as they walk, so unless you FUCKING run, you have to inhale their bullshit.

You want to live near a nice forest? WELL FUCK YOU, someone was an ass and threw a hot cigarette butt out the window and it started a massive forest fire that destroys thousands of homes, including yours.

Fuck you people for complaining about upping the age limit. Not like it every stopped people from doing anything anyways. Plus some of you are over 21 already, so the fuck do you care? What? You want more smokers at a young age? Smoking is a shitty fucking selfish habit that impacts EVERYONE within a 30 foot radius of you. The culture around smoking is just as toxic as the act itself.

As for vaping, fuck those people too.

Tired of walking down the street and dealing with your shit because you feel entitled to making this decision "Well it's my body, I'll do what I want, I have that right" well it's also the bodies of everyone near you too. Breathing in your fucking bullshit.

This isn't a government being too nosy, smoking is just fucking stupid and selfish.

An 18 year old can fight for their country and die, hell they might do some good in the meantime (or bad, whatever), but NOTHING good has EVER come from smoking.

Why do you people insist on defending this so god damn much?

I don't even smoke. But if I ever find you. I'm going to go buy a case of cigarettes. And chain smoke, even break them cigarettes up and reroll them even bigger while I'm chain smoking.

Just light cigarettes, take a few puffs, throw it under your hood, and light another.

Then walk up the hill, see how many cigarettes I can smoke at the same time.

Then, I'm going to find this intake vent. Light as many cigarettes that thing can hold, so its in taking 100% cigarette smoke.

I don't know how long it will take, but god willing I will get emphysema and lung cancer. So on beautiful summer afternoons when your windows are open. I can smoke with my oxygen tank next to your balcony. Coughing my lungs up. Hopefully blowing myself into a million pieces all over your cigarette butt covered sidewalk.

Not because fuck you. But because you go to soccer games. And that's gross.

[niknik]

Originally Posted by smccarthy945 ↗

I don't think the govt should have the right to tell you what you can or cannot put in your own body including smoking. Let's say you and I were the only two people alive on earth - what would give me the right to tell you what you cannot eat, smoke, take etc? So why should the govt have this right?

Portugal had a huge drug problem in the 90s and they decided to decriminalize everything and move all the money from incarceration to education and rehabilitation. It took the stigma away from drug use ect and people were not afraid to ask for help anymore.

Now there are practically NO overdose deaths in Portugal now and drug use a WAY down. All the detractors screamed that Portugal would become a drug users mecca but the opposite happened.

Don't believe me just google "Portugal decriminalization success" or read the article below:

https://time.com/longform/portugal-d...iminalization/

When you make people responsible for their own actions and make something legal and not "tabu" people don't want it anymore. Same thing happened when alcohol was under prohibition. Everyone wanted it and an entire illegal market was formed to provide it.

The same thing is happening with the cartels with drugs. There is a demand and tons of profits to be made so the cartels simply provide the same as the mob did during prohibition.

This war is absolutely useless. Drug use rates and deaths continue to climb along with overdose deaths because people don't know what they are buying and are afraid to get locked up and their lives ruined.

The idea of "Well people shouldn't use drugs" is as stupid as saying "People shouldn't have sex" if they don't want to get pregnant. It's a stupid unrealistic idea.

Of course drugs are bad and addiction is terrible but what we are doing right now isn't working and the few countries who have taken money and shifted it from criminalization to prevention and treatment have had unbelievable success.

The bottom line is that people have been using drugs since the beginning of time and it's not going to miraculously stop anytime soon. We can either let the govt keep doing the same stupid "war on drugs" strategy or we can demand decriminalization and treat drug use as a health problem and not a "war".

I don't know how you declare war on your uncles, aunts, cousins, mothers, fathers, etc when they have a health problem such as addition. Hey Dad, I am sorry you are addicted to cocaine so we are going to have to go to war with you so strap up and get ready for a battle! Instead of saying "Dad I know you have an addition problem and there is help available without the risk of you getting a felony and ruining your entire life b/c you are unemployable for the rest of your life".

People hide in the shadows because they don't want to get a felony that will cause they to be unemployable for the rest of their lives which in turn causes people not to seek the help they need or overdose from drugs b/c of the same reasons.

We need to demand that this "war" stops and drugs are decriminalized so it can be treated as a health issue instead of a "war" on our own families and friends.

I don't know if you meant too. But you kinda misrepresented Portugal drug laws and what they did. They didn't really decriminalize it. Drugs are still illegal.

But as long as you have a small amount, instead of facing jail, you are forced into rehab programs. I believe this frees up law enforcement more to focus on the dealers and manufacturers and smugglers. Who they aggressively seek and punish.

There's no doubt that this has brought down dramatically the overdose problem, and brought down the spread of HIV. But they still have a rather high rate of new HIV cases compared to their neighbors.

But overall what Portugal did was a success. But it's far from just legalization and letting people do whatever drugs they want.

In reality they started their own version of the war on drugs. But instead of locking up low level addicts, they aggressively use treatment programs and education programs.