[Dr Thrumpkinz]

Originally Posted by echonovember ↗

To clarify why the rescuer was able to touch the victim without ending up in a similar situation, look at how his hands were positioned when they made contact.

They were fully open, and he only touched the victim by the fingers, not the palm, or with him trying to grasp the victim to pull him away.

This meant that, even if the muscles of his hand did contract due to the current, there wasn't a risk that he'd be involuntarily grabbing the victim.

...damn quick thinking on his part with the towel though.

I've added your comment to the main post. Thank you.

That's actually something I wondered too. Why it always looks like people are actually sticking to what is electrocuting them? Like a magnet does metal.
I wondered if you positioned yourself off balance, weight off centre--something like in the Limbo position, leaning, or standing on one foot, would your own weight in the opposite direction be enough to break this connection. But now, I learn that it's probably however tight someone's grip is that your weight would need to battle.

In this case it would have taken much more than just the weight of his lean, or really any other position, to detach his friend--you can see the jerking force it took to remove him. Someone even commented that he could have damaged the dudes throat.
I would like to know how much force, in pounds, it takes to break an average person's hand's grip?

[echonovember]

Originally Posted by Dr Thrumpkinz ↗

I've added your comment to the main post. Thank you.

That's actually something I wondered too. Why it always looks like people are actually sticking to what is electrocuting them? Like a magnet does metal.
I wondered if you positioned yourself off balance, weight off centre--something like in the Limbo position, leaning, or standing on one foot, would your own weight in the opposite direction be enough to break this connection. But now, I learn that it's probably however tight someone's grip is that your weight would need to battle.

In this case it would have taken much more than just the weight of his lean, or really any other position, to detach his friend--you can see the jerking force it took to remove him. Someone even commented that he could have damaged the dudes throat.
I would like to know how much force, in pounds, it takes to break an average person's hand's grip?

The first thing to remember is that, once a current of sufficient strength is applied, nothing a person does can stop the muscles affected from contracting. It doesn't matter is you psyche yourself up, or try to fight it, you've going to lose the battle.

Note: For a "safe" example of this, you can purchase any of the consumer-level muscle stimulation systems (I think abdominal ones are the most common). Attach the electrodes to and muscle group (according to manufacturer instructions), and start turning up the strength of the pulse. You'll quickly see that you cannot stop the contraction, and that, even when it becomes painful, you can do nothing to stop it...barring turning off the device, which you should do long before this point.

If you are grasping something, it's best to view it as every muscle in your hand, arm, and even body, contracting to the greatest extent possible. Muscles commonly suffer tears as a result or electrical trauma just because they contract pretty much to the fullest extent possible.

If you're grasping something, you're not going to be able to consciously let go. Additionally, any action taken to break contact will require enough force to counter this grasping force.

For most people, just falling away won't be enough, as your grip, particularly without the normal limitations of pain or fatigue, won't be strong enough.

Now there are options for a rescuer, as we see in this video. I've also read reports of bystanders full on tackling victims, as the force of an adult human crashing into another at full speed is generally sufficient to force the victim away from the electrical source...the effects on their fingers is another matter entirely, as a mesh barrier/fence could mean a LOT of damage...but better than dead.

For the victim here, even damage to the throat is better than remaining in contact with the grate.

Basically, if the current causes you to grasp something, you're not getting away on your own.

Both individuals here were lucky.

As in the case here, using a non-conductive tool also works...and I wish I could find the video now, but bashing someone with a 2X4 also works.

[murofhsirgo]

I'm going to start wearing one of those things tomorrow. Way to go bro, A++

[Dr Thrumpkinz]

Originally Posted by echonovember ↗

The first thing to remember is that, once a current of sufficient strength is applied, nothing a person does can stop the muscles affected from contracting. It doesn't matter is you psyche yourself up, or try to fight it, you've going to lose the battle.

Note: For a "safe" example of this, you can purchase any of the consumer-level muscle stimulation systems (I think abdominal ones are the most common). Attach the electrodes to and muscle group (according to manufacturer instructions), and start turning up the strength of the pulse. You'll quickly see that you cannot stop the contraction, and that, even when it becomes painful, you can do nothing to stop it...barring turning off the device, which you should do long before this point.

If you are grasping something, it's best to view it as every muscle in your hand, arm, and even body, contracting to the greatest extent possible. Muscles commonly suffer tears as a result or electrical trauma just because they contract pretty much to the fullest extent possible.

If you're grasping something, you're not going to be able to consciously let go. Additionally, any action taken to break contact will require enough force to counter this grasping force.

For most people, just falling away won't be enough, as your grip, particularly without the normal limitations of pain or fatigue, won't be strong enough.

Now there are options for a rescuer, as we see in this video. I've also read reports of bystanders full on tackling victims, as the force of an adult human crashing into another at full speed is generally sufficient to force the victim away from the electrical source...the effects on their fingers is another matter entirely, as a mesh barrier/fence could mean a LOT of damage...but better than dead.

For the victim here, even damage to the throat is better than remaining in contact with the grate.

Basically, if the current causes you to grasp something, you're not getting away on your own.

Both individuals here were lucky.

Thank you. Your two entries have taught me more valuable information about electricity than I have accumulated over my whole life. Everyone should read this.

Seriously. And since this thread is in its downward slope of viewability, I have decided to make an electrocution compilation video. I even think I've already picked a song for it--from memory though, so I still need to find it and make sure.

We used to explore the old subterranean portions of Vancouver sometimes. You could access all sorts of cavernous places and tunnels if you just knew where to access the old levels of the previous sidewalks. Anyhow, I think all the electricity down there had long been shut off, but sometimes we'd find some cool stuff in the dark. Once, a huge mummified rat, with its two front teeth still imbedded in this fat cable. It must have climbed this wall, and made it to this lip that had a couple of cables running along it, and just sunk its teeth into it to pull itself up onto the ledge, so it was still hanging off the wall. I took a picture of it.

Originally Posted by echonovember ↗

As in the case here, using a non-conductive tool also works...and I wish I could find the video now, but bashing someone with a 2X4 also works.

So, like this sort of? Only with a shovel, and also backwards.

[echonovember]

Originally Posted by Dr Thrumpkinz ↗

Thank you. Your two entries have taught me more valuable information about electricity than I have accumulated over my whole life. Everyone should read this.

Seriously. And since this thread is in its downward slope of viewability, I have decided to make an electrocution compilation video. I even think I've already picked a song for it--from memory though, so I still need to find it and make sure.

We used to explore the old subterranean portions of Vancouver sometimes. You could access all sorts of cavernous places and tunnels if you just knew where to access the old levels of the previous sidewalks. Anyhow, I think all the electricity down there had long been shut off, but sometimes we'd find some cool stuff in the dark. Once, a huge mummified rat, with its two front teeth still imbedded in this fat cable. It must have climbed this wall, and made it to this lip that had a couple of cables running along it, and just sunk its teeth into it to pull itself up onto the ledge, so it was still hanging off the wall. I took a picture of it.



So, like this sort of? Only with a shovel, and also backwards.

If you want any commentary on the compilation, let me know. I'm the scientist kind of Dr., but I've dealt with more of this stuff than is sane over the years...enough to know that the lab was the best place for me, not the ER.

As for the clip...it is effective, but the end effect is about the same as the electrocution.

I'm reminded of a joke growing up.

A young girl is saying her prayers before bedtime. "Lord, please let me die quietly, in my sleep, like grandpa...not screaming, like the others in his car."

Note: Years in the lab may have warped my concept of funny.

[Dirty18]

But please...don't do it with a wet towel!

[Neuromancer]

His knight in flowing, breathable armor

[Dr_Jackal]

It's good to see a video like this, even on this site. Quick thinking on that man!

[Ms Moody]

[philovan]

"As in the case here, using a non-conductive tool also works...and I wish I could find the video now, but bashing someone with a 2X4 also works".[/QUOTE]

Why would bashing someone work? The muscle contractions are non voluntary, so even if the victim is rendered unconscious this will not cause them to relax. Also, I don't think that "bashing" him will prod the victim's body away from the current source.