[scorpion9]

Originally Posted by duntez ↗

they were not suppose to kill them on puporse,but instead following "burned out land" western military rule? In case of any civilian casualties, they can be used against Russia and in favor of Ukraine. I think it makes perfect sense.

now about your quote, that was actually me with my 2 cents of clarification on how it can be done lol

What exactly is "burned out land" western military rule? Something that RT keeps telling you about?

Western war is far more "civilized" than any other, thanks to precision weapons and good intel.
The west does everything to avoid civilian casualties precisely because of the public oppinion. Russia(or other dictatorships) have no reason to be afraid of the public oppinion, and therefore can afford to bombard cities indiscriminately. Russia can easily commit total genocide(lets say, kill 100 000 civilians in a city) and it would have almost no negative effect in their home territory.

Same goes for intel. Russians(and dictators in general) have far shittier intel, so they tend to hit targets on a "hunch", or hit rough areas of where there might be some enemy soldiers.


This doesnt mean that the above video is fake. It may be true, it may be exaggerated. In any case, it is very suspicious that the way they chose to "come clean" is in front of the camera, in public, spreading the news first into Russia, then let it percolate into Ukraine.
In a case like this, a squad would reject the commands before even going out on a mission, file a complaint to superiors etc. There are far better ways if handling these situations than knowingly posting something that feeds 100% into your enemys propaganda machine.

The fact is, Russia is the master of misinformation. Their dictator is a former KGB agent. They have an entire network of spies, informants and content fabricators in Ukraine. Accepting anything from Russian side needs to be scrutinized thoroughly. I.e look at the footage where russian special ops team prevented a terrorist attack - with the scenes of 3 SIM's games, legible signature ... etc.
There are other videos like that, where you can see same FSB faces over and over, in different videos. Wheter they are soldiers in hospital beds, nurses taking care of them, voters in queues, supporters in rallies etc.

I guess, we will see how this story turns out. If its true, im sure whoever gave those orders gets saked or worse. Considerign that everyones faces are visible, it shouldnt be difficult to investigate this case.

[duntez]

Originally Posted by AnonX93 ↗

I think Russia has "donated" more vehicles, weapons, armor, and munitions to Ukraine than the U.S. has, with all the shit they keep abandoning.

I think the plan was to give away old Soviets metal and get all kind of modern weapons from NATO in return- for usage obviously, but most importantly for examination, starting with rifles, NLAws and higher

[duntez]

Originally Posted by scorpion9 ↗

What exactly is "burned out land" western military rule? Something that RT keeps telling you about?

Western war is far more "civilized" than any other, thanks to precision weapons and good intel.
The west does everything to avoid civilian casualties precisely because of the public oppinion. Russia(or other dictatorships) have no reason to be afraid of the public oppinion, and therefore can afford to bombard cities indiscriminately. Russia can easily commit total genocide(lets say, kill 100 000 civilians in a city) and it would have almost no negative effect in their home territory.

Same goes for intel. Russians(and dictators in general) have far shittier intel, so they tend to hit targets on a "hunch", or hit rough areas of where there might be some enemy soldiers.


This doesnt mean that the above video is fake. It may be true, it may be exaggerated. In any case, it is very suspicious that the way they chose to "come clean" is in front of the camera, in public, spreading the news first into Russia, then let it percolate into Ukraine.
In a case like this, a squad would reject the commands before even going out on a mission, file a complaint to superiors etc. There are far better ways if handling these situations than knowingly posting something that feeds 100% into your enemys propaganda machine.

The fact is, Russia is the master of misinformation. Their dictator is a former KGB agent. They have an entire network of spies, informants and content fabricators in Ukraine. Accepting anything from Russian side needs to be scrutinized thoroughly. I.e look at the footage where russian special ops team prevented a terrorist attack - with the scenes of 3 SIM's games, legible signature ... etc.
There are other videos like that, where you can see same FSB faces over and over, in different videos. Wheter they are soldiers in hospital beds, nurses taking care of them, voters in queues, supporters in rallies etc.

I guess, we will see how this story turns out. If its true, im sure whoever gave those orders gets saked or worse. Considerign that everyones faces are visible, it shouldnt be difficult to investigate this case.

I don’t watch RT, in fact that’s why I was curious for anyone here to show me where they BSing people, to understand how bad they are. It turns out that they don’t lie that much if any, rather showing news with different angle, well that’s what western media does too.

It came from watching over the years how some NATO countries invading other territories, taking cities etc. And I just wonder how civilized was western war during WW2? What about Belgian, Italian and Canadian UN peacekeepers that have been involved in numerous war crimes, including notorious ones such as "roasting a Somali teenager", "public rape of a Somali girl on a tank", "murder of a child by Canadian peacekeepers" and many others. Is it civilized western war or not?
Canadian "peacemaker" Clayton Matchee poses with a 16-year-old Somali boy on March 16, 1993 at the Canadian Airborne Regiment (CAR) base in Belet Huen, Somalia. He was raped many times, burned his genitals with cigarettes. The boy died from his injuries. On the second - the well-known "roasting". No one was punished, by the way. Portrayed as a hero in the Black Hawk Down propaganda film, Silver Star Ranger John "Stubby" Stebbins was sentenced to 30 years in a US prison for raping his own 6-year-old daughter. His ex-wife publicly spoke out against the film. This is how history is written. And it's being written right now. Sorry went a little off topic. Lol
This is not a first time a company or w/e going public on Ukr side. I’ve posted around 10 videos of a different brigades over the past 7 month complaining, some updates them got themself into a real problems. Social media is a powerful tool, and talking to a master sergent in Ukr or Rus will not do anything sometimes. Look what’s going on in Russia, some folks going on social media about how mobilization is going, people share/react and most of the problems been taking care of… not sure if it would happen without bringing people attention.

I’m not saying this video is true. In fact for me it’s hard to believe they would kill their wounded, for me, being half Ukr, my brain don’t want to believe this info. The same goes for Rus atrocities in Bucha and Izum. Well Izum is just straight up BS anyway.

[scorpion9]

Originally Posted by duntez ↗

I don’t watch RT, in fact that’s why I was curious for anyone here to show me where they BSing people, to understand how bad they are. It turns out that they don’t lie that much if any, rather showing news with different angle, well that’s what western media does too.

It came from watching over the years how some NATO countries invading other territories, taking cities etc. And I just wonder how civilized was western war during WW2? What about Belgian, Italian and Canadian UN peacekeepers that have been involved in numerous war crimes, including notorious ones such as "roasting a Somali teenager", "public rape of a Somali girl on a tank", "murder of a child by Canadian peacekeepers" and many others. Is it civilized western war or not?
Canadian "peacemaker" Clayton Matchee poses with a 16-year-old Somali boy on March 16, 1993 at the Canadian Airborne Regiment (CAR) base in Belet Huen, Somalia. He was raped many times, burned his genitals with cigarettes. The boy died from his injuries. On the second - the well-known "roasting". No one was punished, by the way. Portrayed as a hero in the Black Hawk Down propaganda film, Silver Star Ranger John "Stubby" Stebbins was sentenced to 30 years in a US prison for raping his own 6-year-old daughter. His ex-wife publicly spoke out against the film. This is how history is written. And it's being written right now. Sorry went a little off topic. Lol
This is not a first time a company or w/e going public on Ukr side. I’ve posted around 10 videos of a different brigades over the past 7 month complaining, some updates them got themself into a real problems. Social media is a powerful tool, and talking to a master sergent in Ukr or Rus will not do anything sometimes. Look what’s going on in Russia, some folks going on social media about how mobilization is going, people share/react and most of the problems been taking care of… not sure if it would happen without bringing people attention.

I’m not saying this video is true. In fact for me it’s hard to believe they would kill their wounded, for me, being half Ukr, my brain don’t want to believe this info. The same goes for Rus atrocities in Bucha and Izum. Well Izum is just straight up BS anyway.

What you cited were individual crimes( which were punished severely ) and don't show the attitude of the western militaries.
What people dont understand is the scale of war. Take Ukrainian army for example.
Its at least 500 000 - 1 000 000, men strong. Now, ask yourself, how many murders/criminal acts take place in cities with a population of half a million or more? Accordign to statistics, its 10 murders a year, per 100 000 citizens in Russia.
Now, if people remain people, and war doesnt bring the best out of people, then we would expect to see 50 unjustified murders commited by the ukrainian side, and about the same on russian side, within the first year.
Now, the reality is that war doesnt bring the best out of people, it brings out the worst. Soldiers are on the edge, constantly in the "fight" mode and cant afford to take any risks.
If you want to show that the western military is worse than militaries of dictatorships, then you need to show something more than individual cases of murders that are within the normal statistics of such a large population. Western militaries investigate these cases and pushish perpetrators harshly( Russia on the other hand doesnt even investigate the cases, which emboldens the perpetrators even more ). Even worse, torture is part of Russia's official military doctrine.

You can see how Russian military gives no shits about civilian population the way they bombard cities with cluster bombs. You can see that Russian army is allowed to steal on a large scale. These aren't single instance cases where Russians have been caught stealing. Not stealing is an exception in Russian army. Stealing is the rule.

Also, RT doesnt show news from a different angle. They flat out lie and make shit up.
Starting from the "we don't attack ukraine - its western hysteria", to "we are not being routed from Kherson and Kharkiv, we are simply repositioning."
According to Russian media, they are not fighting against Ukrainians....they are fighting against NATO soldiers. Apparently, most of the soldiers on the front lines are NATO soldiers. The reality is that whatever volunteers there are from the west are such a tiny minority in the armed forces that they count as a "token" force.

If you know that the Russian government is rotten in the head, and that this rotten head controls RT, why do you expect to get accurate information from them?


The West, in general, has been on the right side of wars. The targets have been dictatorships and "cunts" in general. I do agree, that how the aftermath of the recent wars has been handled has been awful, and reeks of incompetence.
If the west had organized a decent "Marshall" plan in Iraq, like they did in post world war 2, then Iraq could have risen from the ashes, with life being significantly better than before.

[duntez]

Originally Posted by scorpion9 ↗

What you cited were individual crimes( which were punished severely ) and don't show the attitude of the western militaries.
What people dont understand is the scale of war. Take Ukrainian army for example.
Its at least 500 000 - 1 000 000, men strong. Now, ask yourself, how many murders/criminal acts take place in cities with a population of half a million or more? Accordign to statistics, its 10 murders a year, per 100 000 citizens in Russia.
Now, if people remain people, and war doesnt bring the best out of people, then we would expect to see 50 unjustified murders commited by the ukrainian side, and about the same on russian side, within the first year.
Now, the reality is that war doesnt bring the best out of people, it brings out the worst. Soldiers are on the edge, constantly in the "fight" mode and cant afford to take any risks.
If you want to show that the western military is worse than militaries of dictatorships, then you need to show something more than individual cases of murders that are within the normal statistics of such a large population. Western militaries investigate these cases and pushish perpetrators harshly( Russia on the other hand doesnt even investigate the cases, which emboldens the perpetrators even more ). Even worse, torture is part of Russia's official military doctrine.

You can see how Russian military gives no shits about civilian population the way they bombard cities with cluster bombs. You can see that Russian army is allowed to steal on a large scale. These aren't single instance cases where Russians have been caught stealing. Not stealing is an exception in Russian army. Stealing is the rule.

Also, RT doesnt show news from a different angle. They flat out lie and make shit up.
Starting from the "we don't attack ukraine - its western hysteria", to "we are not being routed from Kherson and Kharkiv, we are simply repositioning."
According to Russian media, they are not fighting against Ukrainians....they are fighting against NATO soldiers. Apparently, most of the soldiers on the front lines are NATO soldiers. The reality is that whatever volunteers there are from the west are such a tiny minority in the armed forces that they count as a "token" force.

If you know that the Russian government is rotten in the head, and that this rotten head controls RT, why do you expect to get accurate information from them?


The West, in general, has been on the right side of wars. The targets have been dictatorships and "cunts" in general. I do agree, that how the aftermath of the recent wars has been handled has been awful, and reeks of incompetence.
If the west had organized a decent "Marshall" plan in Iraq, like they did in post world war 2, then Iraq could have risen from the ashes, with life being significantly better than before.

I agree with you and I didn’t want to prove that western armies are worse. Rather to show that word “civilized” is questionable during war times and west is not so clean either . That’s what triggered me. If we are taking about large scale war, have you herd of “what soldiers do” book about about at least 14K raped French women by US/UK soldiers, Carpet bombing of Dresden? Carpet Bombing of Japan ( 600000 civilian).. 2 nuclear bombs.. usage of the shells with depleted Uranium in Yugoslavia And so on.
While I acknowledge that western military is more organized and everything that comes with it, I can’t accept that they are angels so to say.

And RT is a news source. If Rus MoD said it was a tactical retreat from Kharkiv, why would they say anything different. They rely on official statement and showing what was said, that what is all about.

[Faust]

Still, no source. Why is it impossible to link a single article?

[scorpion9]

Originally Posted by duntez ↗

I agree with you and I didn’t want to prove that western armies are worse. Rather to show that word “civilized” is questionable during war times and west is not so clean either . That’s what triggered me. If we are taking about large scale war, have you herd of “what soldiers do” book about about at least 14K raped French women by US/UK soldiers, Carpet bombing of Dresden? Carpet Bombing of Japan ( 600000 civilian).. 2 nuclear bombs.. usage of the shells with depleted Uranium in Yugoslavia And so on.
While I acknowledge that western military is more organized and everything that comes with it, I can’t accept that they are angels so to say.

And RT is a news source. If Rus MoD said it was a tactical retreat from Kharkiv, why would they say anything different. They rely on official statement and showing what was said, that what is all about.

I dont think anyone thinks that any army is "a group of angels". War is hell. I hope everyone knows that its not how its depicted in holliwood movies. And, in general, I agree with the decision made by the west during the second world war about nuking Japan and carpet bombing the cities. You trade lives. Invading the Japanese mainland would have cost more lives than the 2 nukes claimed. Better pay with the fewer lives of the aggressor than more lives of your own countrymen. I dont agree with the targets for those nukes though. The US could have dropped them on some naval bases or military targets and most likely would have achieved the same result - capitulation of Japan.

"If Rus MoD said it was a tactical retreat from Kharkiv, why would they say anything different."
Exactly...and thats the problem. They are not a news agency. They are not investigative journalism that checks facts and reports whats most likely true. They report what they are told to report. If they are told to lie by the government, then they lie...and you as a viewer of RT will make decisions based on lies.
It would be better to just read russian blog posts or social media than to watch their state propaganda.

[pastinho]

scorpion9 Do you really have nothing to do in life than argue with two toilet brushes like Faust/downutez working on a keyboard in Germany installed by Prigozhin there, sending Euros to parents in Russia beaten in the head with stools by the FSB + sticking their heads into the privy ? xd Thx in advance :v

[AnonX93]

Originally Posted by duntez ↗

I agree with you and I didn’t want to prove that western armies are worse. Rather to show that word “civilized” is questionable during war times and west is not so clean either . That’s what triggered me. If we are taking about large scale war, have you herd of “what soldiers do” book about about at least 14K raped French women by US/UK soldiers, Carpet bombing of Dresden? Carpet Bombing of Japan ( 600000 civilian).. 2 nuclear bombs.. usage of the shells with depleted Uranium in Yugoslavia And so on.
While I acknowledge that western military is more organized and everything that comes with it, I can’t accept that they are angels so to say.

And RT is a news source. If Rus MoD said it was a tactical retreat from Kharkiv, why would they say anything different. They rely on official statement and showing what was said, that what is all about.

I am willing to give you nuking Japan in August 1945. The consequences of Nuclear Weapons were not entirely clear at that point in time and is an example of how NOT to use them. Do I think we should apologize for it? No...because I "believe" that the intentions were good in their usage.

Fast forward 78 years...today we all know the consequences of nuclear weapons and know that they should never be used in combat. Anyone...including the United States or any western country would be equally guilty of the highest crimes against humanity possible if used today.

No military is innocent however...I would argue to the point that was being discussed here that western militaries are more LIKELY to not intentionally bomb civilian targets because of the amount of scrutiny our leadership is under. If the Taliban used a mosque as a base to initiate force or store weapons...you best believe that the evidence must be beyond reasonable doubt...because you know Al Jazera...RT...even CNN will be the first people posting about it and how horrible it was and it how it will be used as fuel to further the cause of terrorism against the United States.

I do have one problem, though, with your reference to the one soldier that was involved in "Black Hawk Down" that raped his daughter...That was something that happened well after this battle and happened at home...Also, his ex-wife wasn't against the movie...just him being portrayed in the movie. The actions of one man acting on his own accord and not on orders of his superiors are different than raping and murdering civilians on orders of your politicians/generals.

[WonderMomma]

Originally Posted by duntez ↗

To be honest i think you took it too personal here, sorry. Not only he didn’t mentioned your name, but also you shared this information yourself, so it’s ok if someone will use it as reference in the future. Otherwise don’t share anything publicly, if you think that could potentially Hurt you if used against you, which it wasn’t in this case, it was just an example which came initially from a trustworthy person, otherwise he wouldn’t even bring that up I think

OH come on Duntez, who else is he referring to with "we have here"?

I gave info on my background and experience to prove I'm credible and know what I'm talking about. After I did, he continually uses my dad fighting in Vietnam as a point of argument, inferring that I should be dismissed because of it. He's also brought my kid into his nonsensical rantings twice previously.

Continuously trolling someone you have on ignore is weak sauce (cowardly) when there's no way for that person to defend against it (he won't see my comments unless someone quotes me).

You don't do that shit... and we recently divorced!