[Faust]

Originally Posted by duntez ↗

In the end of July CIA director estimates 15000 killed, British intelligence estimated 20000.
And Russian BBC together with "mediazona" ( foreign agent in Russia) and volunteers found only confirmed dead soldiers around 6500.

Ukraine - 58150.

With arithmetic mean to be 25000

Nothing against Whiskey (I mean friends call him Whiskey right? :P), but it is just selective believing.

Choose your own narrative basically. Ukraine is like a men/woman at the same time. With the woman part being their own casualties, and the men part being the russian casualties.

Like a man say: “I slept with 20 women” (/we killed 60.000 russians); you have to divide that number by at least 3.
When I woman says “I slept with 4 guys” (/we suffered 5.000 casualties); you have to multiply that number by at least 3.

The selective believing part is; when Ukraine said: we are losing 500 people a day. Some people here don’t want to believe it, so they start their coping process; “they are probably exaggerating to get more US funding, clever! I know they are soooo strong and brave and will never suffer that much losses, unlike the russians lol”
I am not saying this is Whiskeys train of thought, but it should be recognisable in one way. You only believe Ukraine when it fits your narrative.

I understand you guys believe you are on the right side of history, which explains the coping strategies, and you very well could be on the right side of history, but yeah, it’s how the brain operates

[Faust]

Originally Posted by kellyhound ↗

What Donbas residents want for their future
Responses for 2019, based on 906 respondents in government-controlled areas of Donbas and 962 in separatist-controlled areas of Donbas.
https://theconversation.com/most-peo...-survey-124849

“ Ukraine’s newly elected president Volodymyr Zelenskiy put ending the war at the centre of his election campaign, alongside fighting corruption. His rhetoric has remained consistent, treating the inhabitants of the areas not currently controlled by Kyiv – the self-declared people’s republics of Donetsk and Luhansk (DNR/LNR) – as fully-fledged Ukrainian citizens and emphasising their reintegration into the Ukrainian state.

In early October, Zelenskiy made an explicit commitment to what’s called the “Steinmeier formula”, proposed in 2016 by the then German foreign minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier. His idea envisaged the sequencing of local elections in the separatist-held Donbas which, if deemed acceptable by the Organisation for Security and Co-operation in Europe, would clear the way towards a permanent special status of the fought-over territories.

While uncertainties remain surrounding the precise gist of Zelenskiy’s commitment, and there have been some early stumbling blocks, it has made the first meeting in three years of the Normandy group, involving the heads of state of Ukraine, Russia, Germany, and France, a realistic prospect.
”

This is in your very own article.
Imagine 3 more years of civil war instead of Zelensky follow up on the promises referenced in your article. Would you as a citizen of that region still believe the person who had resumed killing you for 3 years instead of working towards peace? Or do you believe there is a chance that people there now could think that uniting with Russia will bring peace at one point? Again, remember that the pro-Ukrainian people, if any, are threatened by their own Ukranian government for having any part in any election.

[Faust]

Originally Posted by kellyhound ↗

Do people in Donbas want to be ‘liberated’ by Russia?
https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...ublic-opinion/

I cannot read that article so if you could copy it, I promise to read it. Anyway, remember that the Washington Post published Zelensky admitting to using human shields in an interview. So the people on this board will probably view The Washington Post as Kremlin sponsored Putin-shills or something:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...w-warn-of-war/

“ Zelensky faces outpouring of criticism over failure to warn of war”

Or do people here think: “Well it’s a clever tactical move to sacrifice civilians if it means better attack opportunities against russia, so a true ‘man of the people’ ”

Again you probably think Washington Post are Kremlin-funded liars, or this is where the selective believing of Whiskey comes into play, which I explained a few posts earlier

[WonderMomma]

Originally Posted by duntez ↗

well "Meduza" is a "foreign agent", stationed in Riga ( Latvia)

I did a little reading on them. It's labeled as "independent" Russian media... a Russian editor started it in 2014 after being fired from another Russia publication and several other editors from same publication went with her. She set it up in Latvia because Russia wasn't going to make things easy for them, according to her. They were banned in Russia for condemning the war in Ukraine.

Which puts it in a similar category as The Moscow Times, which I have used as one of many sources in the last 7 months. In March this year, they moved their headquarters to Amsterdam amid the restrictions in Russia on reporting the war in Ukraine. Russia has since banned them as well.

So basically, any former Russia media outlet who speaks out against the war and essentially against the Russian government, is no longer considered legit Russian media to the RF, some Russians and pro-Russians alike.

[WonderMomma]

FYI, on any paywalls on any media websites, if you're on a computer you can disable JavaScript to bypass it.

Hit F12
Settings Cogwheel at the very top
Scroll all the way to Debugger and check "Disable JavaScript".
Click on the page you're trying to read, hit ctrl R to refresh and the paywall will go away. You must keep the settings open.


And Zelenskyy didn't say the term "human shields". Some people see it that way, but he didn't say anything of the sort. People were pissed he noted the economy as a part of his decision so naturally, people like you are putting words in his mouth which we all know you're a pro with.

In the interview with The Post, published Tuesday, Zelensky cited his fears that Ukrainians would panic, flee the country and trigger economic collapse as the reason he chose not to share the stark warnings passed on by U.S. officials regarding Russia’s plans.

“If we had communicated that … then I would have been losing $7 billion a month since last October, and at the moment when the Russians did attack, they would have taken us in three days,” Zelensky said.

He added that subsequent events — with Russian troops failing to reach the capital — suggested he had made the right call.

[duntez]

Originally Posted by WonderMomma ↗

I did a little reading on them. It's labeled as "independent" Russian media... a Russian editor started it in 2014 after being fired from another Russia publication and several other editors from same publication went with her. She set it up in Latvia because Russia wasn't going to make things easy for them, according to her. They were banned in Russia for condemning the war in Ukraine.

Which puts it in a similar category as The Moscow Times, which I have used as one of many sources in the last 7 months. In March this year, they moved their headquarters to Amsterdam amid the restrictions in Russia on reporting the war in Ukraine. Russia has since banned them as well.

So basically, any former Russia media outlet who speaks out against the war and essentially against the Russian government, is no longer considered legit Russian media to the RF, some Russians and pro-Russians alike.

I know their history lol but yeah, Medusa is one that doesn’t have US money flow.

[Faust]

for me to read your posts I need to press command + L, C; command + shift + N, V
I could do that in less than a second but still, it would be wasted, don’t bother disliking my posts, I’d rather not see your name at all

[Faust]

Looks like the double posting bug is back!

[Faust]

Originally Posted by WhiskeyOutpost ↗

Christ.

Drone dropped VOG grenade direct hit on a wounded Russian tanker

Not going into ethics but let’s say this is a wounded UKR soldier and a RU drone operator kills him, would you consider that a war crime? Not this video obviously but wounded Ukrainian soldier being killed by a Russian operator? That has to be a war crime no?

Edit: becbunzen
Thanks, that was my point. So it is not a war crime if wounded Russians are being killed because they didn’t sign any convention, understandable

[becbunzen]

Originally Posted by Faust ↗

Not going into ethics but let’s say this is a wounded UKR soldier and a RU drone operator kills him, would you consider that a war crime? Not this video obviously but wounded Ukrainian soldier being killed by a Russian operator? That has to be a war crime no?

It can be a crime war, but Russian don't respect the conventions, why respect against them?