Vince Neal's Jet Skids Off Runway at SDL 1 dead

[akham]

Hot off the press ....

[akham]

Prior damage to the left main gear is big news.

Juan can't confirm if there was a hard landing or not or where the jet touched down, but is of the opinion that damaged left main gear caused the excursion (a reasonable conclusion based on the new information).

With damaged left main, it might have even been the case that the most gentle landing in the world could cause weakened gear to suddenly fail. Maybe the unstabilized approach, although bad flying, had nothing to do with it?

[William May]

Originally Posted by akham

Maybe this pic helps?

Thanks, Akham!! That is the FIRST pic from the FRONT of the situation! I was hoping for a closeup to see how badly damaged the cockpit area is, but it is still hard to see.
This 35 DOES NOT have thrust reversers, which is very rare. It must be one of the very earliest Lear 35's, and have a low serial number.

[akham]

Originally Posted by William May

This 35 DOES NOT have thrust reversers, which is very rare. It must be one of the very earliest Lear 35's, and have a low serial number.

S/N 652, mfg date 1989.

[akham]

https://x.com/bizjets101/status/1889...060245/photo/1

Maybe damage to L/H main tires caused damage to brakes or associated equipment meaning the KSDL event was caused by uncommanded L/H main brakes (or lock up), leading to runway exccursion during which the L/H main sheared off?

That would seem to fit all that we know at present.

(Sorry for the posting storm).

[Hogmann]

Originally Posted by akham

https://x.com/bizjets101/status/1889...060245/photo/1

Maybe damage to L/H main tires caused damage to brakes or associated equipment meaning the KSDL event was caused by uncommanded L/H main brakes (or lock up), leading to runway exccursion during which the L/H main sheared off?

That would seem to fit all that we know at present.

(Sorry for the posting storm).

Interesting. Assuming it was the same pilot and a lot of part 91 privately owned Jets have consistent crew as opposed to rotating crew like at a charter operation. Let's just say any damage was completely repaired but why did the plane land short of the runway? If it's the same pilot maybe it shows he has a habit for trying to touch down too early.

[akham]

Originally Posted by Hogmann

If it's the same pilot maybe it shows he has a habit for trying to touch down too early.

Seems likely. Normalization of deviance.

In theory I should be able to get the ADS-B data from the 2024 incident. Will see if I can. Will also see if I can get any other historical data for the airframe, or of Neal's other a/c, to see if a pattern emerges.

This is a great example of how you can be trying to figure out what happened, and a single piece of information comes along that totally changes the equation.

I still wanna know if there are skid marks on the runway!

[akham]

Here's partial ADS-B data for the N81VN approach into KMLC on 2024-06-20 when they reportedly burst a tire.

https://globe.adsbexchange.com/?icao...amp=1718904811

(Screenshot attached for convenience)

365kts G/S at 9275ft! Don’t know what the wind speed was at 9000ft (trying to get historical data from NOAA) but what is the chance they had a 110kt tail wind to comply with the max 250kts IAS below 10kft?

299kts G/S at 3550ft (pressure alt, about 2,700ft above field elevation) approx. 16NM from the field.

245kts G/S at 2575ft (pressure alt, about 1800 above field) approx. 8.7NM from the field.

Shame I don’t (yet) have data closer to ground, but looks a bit hot to me! Guessing they might have had a bit of energy to disperse on the rwy!!!

[akham]

Forgot to mention (sorry for another post, but I can't edit) that the descent rate on that approach into KMLC was 2368ft/min at 2575ft (pressure alt, 1800ft above ground) at about 8.7NM from the field.

It was 3264ft/min at 9275ft (pressure), 3500/min at 10kft.

[William May]

You fancy-dancy kids today!! Back in MY day, all we had was a little monkey on a chain in the cockpit, and if he started shitting, we were too fast and too low.


If you scared the monkey too often, they started calling you "Captain Poop"!