[Sharon]

Many valid points raised in this thread These debates are a hot potato. Very delicate, awkward, insulting to one another. Tolerance will never happen as long as certain behaviours exist on all sides.

Why was I threatened in Egypt with being shot for wearing a cross??? Why were my legs slapped also by a burka clad old lady when I was on a camel??? The tourist police claimed I was 'asking for it' because I was a blonde tourist daring to show my forearms and knees when I was groped. That is not fucking acceptable and if WE here in the West treated any other religious group like that, we'd be fucked. Taken to court and everything. Why can they get away with it and we can't??? Just a point

[rob666]

Originally Posted by Sharon. ↗

Many valid points raised in this thread These debates are a hot potato. Very delicate, awkward, insulting to one another. Tolerance will never happen as long as certain behaviours exist on all sides.

Why was I threatened in Egypt with being shot for wearing a cross??? Why were my legs slapped also by a burka clad old lady when I was on a camel??? The tourist police claimed I was 'asking for it' because I was a blonde tourist daring to show my forearms and knees when I was groped. That is not fucking acceptable and if WE here in the West treated any other religious group like that, we'd be fucked. Taken to court and everything. Why can they get away with it and we can't??? Just a point

Because thats how some of them choose to live, in their own Country.
Do I agree with it? No, I don't understand it and I don't really care too either..... If I was going to travel to another country, I'd probably try my best to realize what i was getting myself into, and honestly Females travelling to Muslim countrys can't just act like they do at home and expect everything to be OK...... This is not something new, its not fair, its fucked up, but just remember it hasn't been that long since American women couldn't vote..... 100 years ago in America you would be considered someones property too.
We also need to realize that some of these fucked up places DO NOT represent the beliefs and attitudes of Muslims everywhere, any more than Jim Jones, Koresh, or Warren Jeffs is the truest representation of Christians everwhere.
Theres people here in America who want to run things based on religion, who are not shy about it anymore either...... I really don't know how any one can be more scared of Muslims turning America into Sharia law than some fucking wingnut like Palin or Bachmann making everybody bow to their brand of Evangelical bullshit.

[Guderian1974]

Originally Posted by rob666 ↗

Because thats how some of them choose to live, in their own Country.
Do I agree with it? No, I don't understand it and I don't really care too either..... If I was going to travel to another country, I'd probably try my best to realize what i was getting myself into, and honestly Females travelling to Muslim countrys can't just act like they do at home and expect everything to be OK...... This is not something new, its not fair, its fucked up, but just remember it hasn't been that long since American women couldn't vote..... 100 years ago in America you would be considered someones property too.
We also need to realize that some of these fucked up places DO NOT represent the beliefs and attitudes of Muslims everywhere, any more than Jim Jones, Koresh, or Warren Jeffs is the truest representation of Christians everwhere.
Theres people here in America who want to run things based on religion, who are not shy about it anymore either...... I really don't know how any one can be more scared of Muslims turning America into Sharia law than some fucking wingnut like Palin or Bachmann making everybody bow to their brand of Evangelical bullshit.

...Hahahahaaaaaa!

[Sharon]

Originally Posted by rob666 ↗

Females travelling to Muslim countrys can't just act like they do at home and expect everything to be OK.

Yet they come over here and act like they do at home. No problem, welcome to the UK. Pisses me right off

WHY do they put head and shoulder coverings on little girls as young as 4??? I saw one such child all wrapped up on a hot day and the poor wee mite was crying as she was visibly too hot. Soaked in sweat.

[Guderian1974]

Originally Posted by Sharon. ↗

WHY do they put head and shoulder coverings on little girls as young as 4??? I saw one such child all wrapped up on a hot day and the poor wee mite was crying as she was visibly too hot. Soaked in sweat.

...Having lived amongst these people for extended periods makes me wonder what the hell they see in any of the madness of their belief...

[ZFORCE]

All of the religions share the same philosphy but each have there own interpretation of it. In islam there is a god and his messenger. In christianity there is a god and his messenger. In judaism there is god and his messengers.

Find me one species on the planet other than homosapiens that are religious and ill start believing.

[Rfneimad]

Based on the inability to understand doubters and the desire to kill and/or convert them, I'd say pure a/theists ARE a different species. The other being the way more advanced people who don't really give a fuck except when the retards from the other species get out of hand with excessive arguing.

[MattyD]

Look John I think we came to some disagreement about this subject, though I mean you no disregard.

The funny thing is that we have to learn from the history of the ancients. I do not originate from Europe, though I have ingratiated myself within European culture and methodology; the history of the ancients as it were. Here we have countries with well over a thousand years of history dealing with the Moors or rather the Muslim faith.

Once you realise this you appreciate the fact that the troubles we face with the muslim faith is but a speck in history; a conflict that has been brewing for well over a thousand years. Whatever animosity you hold against the muslim faith is just that; a spec in the history books.

Our last discussion revolved around your assumption that I somehow attacked the American peoples (which is what I garnered at least), though your insults towards me was such that it did not warrant a response). I mean no one speaks to me like that because I would smash their face in. I may be Samoan and I may appear seemingly acquiescent, but get on the wrong side of me and I will smash your face in. I'm being honest here.

You have to learn from the history of the ancients. I have lived in the UK for over 20 years and I love the history of the Island. Only a fool would disregard the history of the British Isles which span well over 1000 years. Really only a fool would believe that how things currently stand would last ad infinitum. Your doom-mongering with regards to how Muslims will rape us is but a dream; something the Bishops that orchestrated the Crusades were saying nearly 1000 years ago. You are but a spec in the history books, and nothing you can state (in terms of contemporary affairs) can ever change that. Come to Europe or Japan and learn the history of the ancients mate. Seriously.

[rob666]

Originally Posted by Sharon. ↗

Yet they come over here and act like they do at home. No problem, welcome to the UK. Pisses me right off

WHY do they put head and shoulder coverings on little girls as young as 4??? I saw one such child all wrapped up on a hot day and the poor wee mite was crying as she was visibly too hot. Soaked in sweat.

I totally agree that is fucked up, and if anybody choses to immigrate to another country they should accept that countrys laws, period.
What i see happening here on this site though is a lot of generalizations being made by someone who is all over the internet, all day & night, spreading the same hateful message to whoever lets him.
It just so happens that Mr Knoefler has found an audience here that is sympathetic to his rhetoric against Muslims, however if you google his name you'd find other similar rants against other minorities such as this-

Really? Really? Where the hell are [the "decent black folk"]? Where were they that night? Only another fellow white person with a gun saved the day. Not the useless police who usually arrive too late. Not the Marine who sadly made the mistake of going out unarmed. And certainly not the socalled "decent black folks". When I see in the papers that black folks hunted these demonic kids down and gave them the real beating they deserve for shaming thier ethnic group then I will believe there are decent black folks, and only then will I believe it. -John Knoefler

You guys are drinking his shit right up, this is all the guy posts up on every site he visits.
Your literally letting this site become his soapbox, you-tube shut down his first account for this shit, so he basically tries to toe the line & see how far he can go with it..... so far he's found his paradise.

You want to see, look for yourselves, he's left his shit stains everywhere.

[MattyD]

Originally Posted by Sharon. ↗

Yet they come over here and act like they do at home. No problem, welcome to the UK. Pisses me right off

WHY do they put head and shoulder coverings on little girls as young as 4??? I saw one such child all wrapped up on a hot day and the poor wee mite was crying as she was visibly too hot. Soaked in sweat.

Hiya Sharon o/

I think it revolves around GLOBALIZATION (globalisation in the UK). Here in the West we are predisposed to imposing our method of thinking on other people; it's been the way Europeans have thought for centuries afterall hehe.

Opening boarders to foreigners for trade means that you thus have to open yourselves up culturally, for you cannot have one and not the other. This is the problem, because for instance the British Empire wanted to expand their authority globally, but did not foresee that by doing so, they would have to open themselves to the '3rd World' who would in turn learn from it; become educated.

Once the British learned that that they could no longer conquer countries so as in order to gain a foothold internationally (during the time whereby nationality and patriotism became a prominent factor), the British tried to defend countries primarily for trade.

You see many people haven't even stopped to think why the UK hasn't tried to assert their authority in Europe, but have done internationally. Isn't it funny that the UK is the only major European country in the last 300-400 years that has not tried to assert its authority over Continental Europe? Afterall the British had Napoleon try twice to conquer Europe and both times he was defeated by coalitions headed by the British. Why then has no one ever thought as to why the British themselves did not then try to conquer Europe after Napoleon's or even Hitler's defeat...the reason simply is because of international trade coercion.

You see, the British and American way of conquering is not by forcibly taking over a country, but by 'seemingly' allowing them to govern themselves. For instance when the UK defeated Napoleon, Britain was able to continue trade with its European neighbours instead of having them feeling threatened as they did when Napoleon had enforced the Continental Blockade (Continental System against British trade). It all revolves around éminence grise and people working behind the scenes.

You have to remember then that Arab countries have not similarly opened themselves up culturally like we have here in the West. In essence we have sold our souls to the devil by having sold our very way of life so as in order to expand our ideologies internationally. It's backfired because now the uneducated have become educated and want a part of what we had originally, by which I mean that even though they have been opened up to Western-orientated ideologies such as technology and media, there is now no boundary as to what they may do. For instance a Muslim woman may not now feel threatened wearing a burka in Europe because European culture is such that they tolerate such things at the expense of their own ideology.

In fact I'm not qualified to explain this (though I know that I am not being racist in my views). However I do know that Europeans need to assert themselves and to assert their cultural identity; they need to differentiate between their desire to expand their culture internationally with a need to preserve its very integrity because by opening themselves up to foreigners in order to expand on their ideology, they are sacrificing a great deal.

I say this within the context of the ages however, for we must remember that the ideas that we come up with are not the first. I am sure Little John Little III who was born in 1312 had the same views as I back in the day, though no one gives a flying fuck as to what he said back then because he's just one of millions...same occurs nowadays I guess.