[Blewvane]

Originally Posted by niknik ↗

I thought the RAAF haven't decided whether they'll use combat aircraft.

As far as i know there is a few FA-18 super hornets, a refuelling tanker, and an AWAC.
https://au.news.yahoo.com/a/25177223...es-against-is/

[rob666]

Originally Posted by niknik ↗

So you think Russia only wanted to protect Russians living in Ukraine? So they supplied fighters with tanks and surface to air missiles?
Russia has a agenda and it has nothing to do with protecting civilians.

Absolutely.

They don't want NATO on it's doorstep any more than America wanted Russian missiles in Cuba.

If Russia wanted to invade, it would. It wouldn't be much of a fight.

[Mr Poo]

Originally Posted by rob666 ↗

Russian nationals, or Russian soldiers operating under the command of Moscow?

There are people from all walks, and mercenaries from many nations fighting for both sides. Most of these mercenaries have extensive combat training, and so e would certainly have the expertise to run a tank.

If Moscow wanted Ukraine, it would have it with 2 days..... There would be no back and forth battle like we've been seeing.

First of all, regardless of the operators there are 100's of tanks in the battalion I showed you. Putin did say that but Russia's hands are dirty, the only reason they don't take Ukraine is because the world is watching. They aren't stupid enough to make that aggressive of a move. The EU would be forced to declare war.

[Mr Poo]

Originally Posted by niknik ↗

Make sure you read the article I posted above.

BTW you just showed how far left you are. Calling what is supposed to be a negotiation, a process where our government is SUPPOSED to come together and make a deal. Terrorism?

You're just too far out there. Conversation with you on politics reminds me of just how screwed we are.

After the Republican-led House of Representatives could not agree on an originating resolution to end the government crisis, as had been agreed, the Democratic-led Senate used bill H.R. 2775 to resolve the impasse, to satisfy the Origination Clause requirement of Article One of the United States Constitution, which requires that revenue bills must originate in the House of Representatives. Traditionally, appropriation bills also originate in the House of Representatives.

[rob666]

Originally Posted by Mr Poo ↗

First of all, regardless of the operators there are 100's of tanks in the battalion I showed you. Putin did say that but Russia's hands are dirty, the only reason they don't take Ukraine is because the world is watching. They aren't stupid enough to make that aggressive of a move. The EU would be forced to declare war.

It's either Russians or it isn't

By that same proxy, America would be guilty of invading half the world because it has supplied weapons and intelligence to it's allies, for self interest, for decades.

The EU isn't going to start WW3 over another nations civil war. They've lived with the consequences of war for centuries, seen their cities burned and invaded.

[Mr Poo]

Originally Posted by rob666 ↗

It's either Russians or it isn't

By that same proxy, America would be guilty of invading half the world because it has supplied weapons and intelligence to it's allies, for self interest, for decades.

The EU isn't going to start WW3 over another nations civil war. They've lived with the consequences of war for centuries, seen their cities burned and invaded.

You can't compare giving or selling weapons to moving active battalions in and out of a sovereign nation.

That would be like the US moving forces into baja california(Mexico) and declaring it US territory. Then using active tank battalions to battle the Mexican government at the Texas border. The whole time claiming it's just upset Mexican citizens that somehow have 100's of our tanks and are using them against the government.

Invasion is far from civil war..

[TheVrist]

Originally Posted by rob666 ↗

The point of the UN was to have an international body decide right vs wrong, based on international laws....... The problem with being the self proclaimed world police is it's usually only based on self interest.

As far as breaking a post war policy, I don't know what policy you're talking about....... When you enter a war based on lies, with no exit strategy, obviously there isn't a policy..... The previous policy was to stay out of Baghdad, and let things play out at a distance ( gulf war 1 ).

There really is no "fixed" policy, it is just something we have done since the North occupied the south under Lincoln (Ironic Obama breaks that tradition) as a way of taking responsibility as a nation. This is why we have occupations still all over the world.

It's called a policy, because it was considered a postwar policy under Lincoln, and for most part, every president since then has honored that regardless of, purpose, or party of the president in office during the declaration of war.

If presidents were pulling an Obama, after each new election, you can imagine the shit storm that would still be going on all over Europe, Japan, Korea over the course of history. It's sole purpose was to prevent a reason to have to return --

Thing is, during elections Americans were still in shell shock over a war they were not use too. It had been decades since Vietnam, and your average joe voters don't even know we have military installations still in korea et el. They think that when you pull out, you literally completely pull out. So it was just a strategy to say "we're pulling ALL our troops out of iraq" to later send troops to Afghanistan.

If he had said, "We will be moving forces to Afghan, but also secure our presence in Iraq" Do you think he would have gotten any vote support in the next election + get backing for war in a whole new place?

Not when naive Americans that don't understand we have postwar responsibilities to look after,and are hell bent on "bring our troops home"

If it was about manpower, and equipment shortage to baby sit Iraq until they were fully restored, I am quite confident we have plenty of post WWII installations still in operation near by that can afford to be relocated. (I know of one I lived at as a kid)

td:dr

Obama broke traditional postwar policy, for personal gain, now it's costing Americans more.

[TheVrist]

(CNN) -- A short video released by ISIS on Friday shows the apparent beheading of British aid worker Alan Henning, with the executioner blaming the death on the United Kingdom for joining the U.S.-led bombing campaign against the group.
Before he is killed, Henning speaks to the camera, referencing the British Parliament's decision to participate in coalition of more than 40 countries who have banded together to go after the so-called Islamic State terror group in Iraq and Syria.
At the end of the video, ISIS shows American aid worker Peter Kassig and threatens his life.
There is no reason to believe the video is not authentic, a U.S. intelligence official told CNN, adding that American officials are studying it.
"The brutal murder of Alan Henning by ISIL shows just how barbaric and repulsive these terrorists are," UK Prime Minister David Cameron said, referring to the group also known as ISIS.
"Alan had gone to Syria to help get aid to people of all faiths in their hour of need," Cameron said. "The fact that he was taken hostage when trying to help others and now murdered demonstrates that there are no limits to the depravity of these ISIL terrorists."
The news of Henning's beheading comes just days after Britain joined the coalition. UK jets began flying reconnaissance flights over Iraq a week ago, and on Tuesday dropped its first missiles on an ISIS heavy-weapon position and an armed pickup truck in Iraq, according to the UK Defense Ministry.
A taxi driver from near Manchester, England, Henning was part of a team of volunteers that traveled to Syria in December 2013 to deliver food and water to people affected by the Middle Eastern country's devastating civil war.

He was abducted the day after Christmas by masked gunmen, according to other people in the aid convoy.
The Prime Minister vowed to bring the killers to justice.
Last week, the British Foreign Office released an audio file of Henning pleading for his life. His wife made a public plea for ISIS to spare his life.
Barbara Henning's pleas were joined by voices of Muslim leaders around the world.
They included Shaykh Haitham Al Haddad, a judge on the Shariah Council in London, who has said that "whatever your grievance with American or British foreign policy, executing this man is not the answer."
But the calls for mercy appear to have been met with bloodshed.
The White House released a statement condemning Henning's murder and vowing to work alongside the UK and its allies to "degrade and ultimately destroy ISIL."
Video similar to others
If the authenticity of the video is confirmed, Henning will be the fourth Westerner to be beheaded on camera by ISIS.
This summer, ISIS beheaded American freelance journalists James Foley and Steven Sotloff -- showing their gruesome killings in videos posted online. ISIS then claimed its first British victim, aid worker David Haines, according to video that appeared online on September 13.
In the video released by ISIS Friday, Henning's name is misspelled "Allen."
Who is the ISIS?
The video is similar to the previous ones, with a clearly scripted statement being delivered by the victim.
But unlike the previous ones, this one is shorter and is shot tightly, showing none of the surroundings.
And just like the previous videos, it ends with a threat to another hostage.
The National Security Council confirmed that Kassig is being held by ISIS.
"We will continue to use every tool at our disposal -- military, diplomatic, law enforcement and intelligence -- to try to bring Peter home to his family," according to agency spokeswoman Caitlin Hayden.
The American who appears at the end of the video, Kassig, is a former soldier who became an aid worker in the Middle East.
Kassig's parents, Ed and Paula, confirmed to CNN it was their son, "who was doing humanitarian work in Syria, is being held captive."
"We ask everyone around the world to pray for the Henning family, for our son, and for the release of all innocent people being held hostage in the Middle East and around the globe," the statement said.
Kassig, 26, founded the non-profit Special Emergency Response and Assistance group. At the time, the organization was providing humanitarian aid to refugees fleeing the Syrian civil war.
Kassig worked as a medic and was en route to Deir Ezzor in northern Syria for SERA when he was kidnapped on October 1, 2013, according to his family.
"I am not a doctor. I am not a nurse. But I am a guy who can clean up bandages, help clean up patients, swap out bandages, help run IVs, make people's quality of life a little bit better," he told CNN's Arwa Damon during an interview in 2012.
"This is something for me that has meaning, that has purpose."
How ISIS is run

[niknik]

Originally Posted by rob666 ↗

The point of the UN was to have an international body decide right vs wrong, based on international laws....... The problem with being the self proclaimed world police is it's usually only based on self interest.

As far as breaking a post war policy, I don't know what policy you're talking about....... When you enter a war based on lies, with no exit strategy, obviously there isn't a policy..... The previous policy was to stay out of Baghdad, and let things play out at a distance ( gulf war 1 ).

The UN is a worthless anti America and anti Israel organization. What good is the UN really? Anything the United Nations does has to be approved by China. Anything the United Nations does has to be approved by Russia. So what you're saying is our enemies decide what's right and wrong. That's insane. America shouldn't ever depend on the United Nations to be the authority on America's or the world's security.

[niknik]

Originally Posted by rob666 ↗

He did say it would cost nothing, he said America would recoup the financial costs through oil sales.

I don't care if some Iraqis welcomed American occupation, or if the mood changes from time to time, the bottom line is things were not as promised.

Again I'm not sure where you're getting these promises. War is fucking war, there are no guarantees. You had your expectations , and obviously they were not realistic.

Like I said previously. Iraq isn't over, I'm confident Iraq will pay back much of the cost of Iraqi Freedom. It didn't help Obama made a mess of the entire operation and set it back years.