[ralucagymnast]

Originally Posted by rob666 ↗

Uh, Russia has done neither

O RLY????

[spycosis]

Originally Posted by ralucagymnast ↗

Yeah, look how well "arming the rebels against Assads regime" went I must admit I got a sinking feeling when I read about arming Syrian opposition, after all, wasnt that what IS were in the beginning??? they were the "opposition" werent they? Thats why I said "time will tell"...

Yeah we changed sides already. Iran are now friends of the West. Doublespeak is good. Thoughtcrime is bad.

[rob666]

Originally Posted by Blewvane ↗

Speaking of Russia, while the coalition has troops and other military assets in the region, it is only a short road to hit Russia right in the nuts. We aint putin up with you ruskie cunts for much longer.

Russia isn't going to roll over and take it like Iraq or the Taliban did. They have a modern, well equipped military, and nuclear capability to hit anywhere on earth.
I don't think military confrontation with them would be a good thing.

[rob666]

Originally Posted by ralucagymnast ↗

O RLY????

Yes, really.

[rob666]

Originally Posted by niknik ↗

I strongly disagree that Saddam could stop any Arab spring uprising. It happened in Egypt, Yemen, Libya, Syria, and have effected many more. But I'm sure Saddam would have murdered thousands of men women and children to fight it. Doesn't mean he would win.
Forced democracy They weren't forced. They wanted it. And it didn't create isis, isis already existed under different names. If anything the unrest in Syria created isis.

What's a failure is Obama's move away from what the Bush administration started. He worked endlessly reversing course to separate himself from Bush. Obama was told this would happen. Bush stated before he left office changing policy would create a nightmare. And he didn't listen, this is Obama's mess. If he didn't want ownership of it he shouldn't of ran for President.
Meddling? What did we do to Afghanistan prior to 9-11? We supported Afghanistan against the Soviets. Most of the hijackers were Saudi nationals. What has America done to Saudi Arabia? America is at war with these people. There's no rationalization to make that makes it our doing.

Sure you can say America shouldn't of invaded Iraq. But that wasn't a invasion to fight Muslims. And the insurgency Wasn't and Isn't a group of Saddam loyalist fighting in his honor.

Obama's biggest problem with foreign policy is he thinks he can appease. He believes like you Americas meddling caused these issues. Just like many believe Israel caused the terror against them. Imo that shows one doesn't fully understand extremist. You don't listen to them. They say exactly what they want and desire.

What the fuck are you talking about? Iraq was invaded, America picked it's government, and democracy wasn't forced?
Yeah, it looks like everything is peachy. ISIS just took out an Iraqi military base 20 miles from Baghdad, and would control the whole nation if not for American military assistance. Looks like the Iraqis have everything under control
The Iraqi people never asked, violently resisted occupation, and still would.

Somehow this is obama's fault?
What the fuck was he supposed to do, leave 200k troops in Iraq indefinitely it was bush that invaded, bush that said the troops would be home in 6 months, and bush that said it would cost no American money.
All for reasons that were complete lies.

This situation we have right now is a direct result of saddams removal. This is EXACTLY why Bush1 didn't take him out in the first gulf war, his successors could be far worse- and in this case the successors could well be ISIS, a Muslim extremist group hell bent on killing all of us at any cost, that are too extreme even for al quada.

So now what do we do with Iraq? Who is responsible for it? Just send troops back in indefinitely? Who's going to foot the bill for that?

[TheVrist]

Originally Posted by rob666 ↗

Russia isn't going to roll over and take it like Iraq or the Taliban did. They have a modern, well equipped military, and nuclear capability to hit anywhere on earth.
I don't think military confrontation with them would be a good thing.

Thing about war with Russia vs America, is it would be limited warfare, and more rules than a NFL football game.

[rob666]

Originally Posted by TheVrist ↗

Thing about war with Russia vs America, is it would be limited warfare, and more rules than a NFL football game.

Or would it? I don't think that 2 nuclear armed nations have ever gone to war....... In the Cold War era the first strike would have been an apocalyptic nuclear one....... Both sides have enough to blow up the earth many times over, and second strike capability.
Faced with imminent invasion and occupation, would Japan or Germany have unleashed nuclear weapons? Even now, ever notice how nobody fucks with North Korea?

[niknik]

Originally Posted by rob666 ↗

What the fuck are you talking about? Iraq was invaded, America picked it's government, and democracy wasn't forced?
Yeah, it looks like everything is peachy. ISIS just took out an Iraqi military base 20 miles from Baghdad, and would control the whole nation if not for American military assistance. Looks like the Iraqis have everything under control
The Iraqi people never asked, violently resisted occupation, and still would.

Somehow this is obama's fault?
What the fuck was he supposed to do, leave 200k troops in Iraq indefinitely it was bush that invaded, bush that said the troops would be home in 6 months, and bush that said it would cost no American money.
All for reasons that were complete lies.

This situation we have right now is a direct result of saddams removal. This is EXACTLY why Bush1 didn't take him out in the first gulf war, his successors could be far worse- and in this case the successors could well be ISIS, a Muslim extremist group hell bent on killing all of us at any cost, that are too extreme even for al quada.

So now what do we do with Iraq? Who is responsible for it? Just send troops back in indefinitely? Who's going to foot the bill for that?

Do you even listen to yourself? We forced freedom on them?

What you're implying is they wanted Saddam. They wanted to never vote, or have the freedom to have a voice. They enjoyed living under a tyrant, being murdered for even speaking of freedom.
Just because we made it possible is far from forcing them.

It shows you don't know the history. Especially of the insurgency that makes up much of Iraqs opposition. Who are mostly not Iraqis. Iraqis did not violently oppose America. That's false. The people who violently opposed American occupation were the insurgents, who now make up isis.
So ya, some people in Iraq wanted America to leave. So they could kill everyone who stands in their way of stopping a democratic Iraq.

[TheVrist]

Originally Posted by rob666 ↗

Or would it? I don't think that 2 nuclear armed nations have ever gone to war....... In the Cold War era the first strike would have been an apocalyptic nuclear one....... Both sides have enough to blow up the earth many times over, and second strike capability.
Faced with imminent invasion and occupation, would Japan or Germany have unleashed nuclear weapons? Even now, ever notice how nobody fucks with North Korea?

No one wants a single nuke executed, especially receiving end players. Thats why north korea has been catered to for decades, the U.S and everyone on board has been trying to settle them through pure democracy. Everyone knows even a hint of imitate threat in their direction they would just start sputtering off their nukes before our already pre destined nukes hit theirs. So essentially it's a huge sacrifice we would have to suffer to bomb a small dot off the map.

Russia, like America, has signed on to play by the rules of war, playing outside of the rules makes us (or them) a direct target of everyone else having to sit around playing by the rules (some of which hate having too as it is) Making the whom ever step outside of the playing field in a vulnerable state.

Us against the world don't stand a chance.

If hypothetically we started war with Russia tomorrow, there would be a world summit that would discuss how much nukes would be allowed, and what targets of each side is warranted.

[niknik]

Originally Posted by rob666 ↗

Or would it? I don't think that 2 nuclear armed nations have ever gone to war....... In the Cold War era the first strike would have been an apocalyptic nuclear one....... Both sides have enough to blow up the earth many times over, and second strike capability.
Faced with imminent invasion and occupation, would Japan or Germany have unleashed nuclear weapons? Even now, ever notice how nobody fucks with North Korea?

I wouldn't say nobody fucks with North Korea. North Korea is extremely isolated because of it's actions. One of the poorest countries on earth and getting poorer thanks to sanctions.
Not to mention the nearly 30,000 American troops we have stationed in South Korea. Oh along with approximately 1,000,000 American and Korean land mines planted along the border. The Korean border is the most militarized border in the world. America recently announced we'll no longer produce or use land mines anywhere in the world, except one place. North Korea.