[Shakey]

I wonder if they believed in God?

[Oddeverything]

M1324, Holocaust denial is a really bizarre position to take. The Heydrich Letter is real, but even if you want to take the stance that it's fake, you still have to deal with the mountains of photographic evidence that Jews, Communists, homosexuals, gypsies and political dissidents were sent to internment and death camps.

if you are intellectually unsound enough to dismiss all that photographic evidence, you then have to deal with the mountains of first hand accounts from both sides of the fence. The Allies could not have brainwashed most of the world within years of the fall of the Third Reich. While you are pondering your extraordinary status as a person who thinks, you might want to look up brainwashing and what it entails because the very suggestion that billions of people had their core values manipulated simultaneously so that they lost their will to think independently en masse about a specific topic and only one specific topic is ludicrous.

To deny the Holocaust happened is to engage in the same sort of unstable thinking that permits some people to think 9/11 didn't happen and that no one died because the whole thing was executed using holograms.

It's fine to think that post-war anger and pain caused events in Germany to be exaggerated. We all know some people have lied about their experiences in concentration camps. Noted skeptic Michael Shermer has gone a long way toward explaning how a traumatized people exaggerate and pass off rumor as fact without really knowing they are doing it - large batches of soap made from human fat is the best example. But to think that mass murder by Germany in the course of war didn't happen is some weak-ass speculation.

Plenty of people engage in revisionism. Lots of people have questions about the Holocaust. Some of them comment on this very site. Either act is not so unheard of that you get to feel special about your status as an online provocateur and condemn others for not falling prey to ideas so bad they would have given Oswald Moseley diarrhea.

td;dr: Dude! Really?

[m1324]

What the hell are you even talking about? Where did I mention the Holocaust? This thread is about the Russian/allied war crimes during the "liberation" of Nazi Germany. Not the liberation of the concentration camps.

[GRiZ]

Originally Posted by bigjoe ↗

Entirely self inflicted. No tears for them. What about the suffering and misery their commie ideology caused the world?

Nobody suffered more at the hands of the Soviet Union than its own people.

That being said, nobody asks to be raped. People are truly powerless to stop their government from doing whatever it wants to do. Sure, there are brief periods where revolutions succeed, but for the most part people have no choice but to stand by and watch helplessly.

[Oddeverything]

Originally Posted by m1324 ↗

What the hell are you even talking about? Where did I mention the Holocaust? This thread is about the Russian/allied war crimes during the "liberation" of Nazi Germany. Not the liberation of the concentration camps.

I completely misread what you were saying. Being egocentric, since I had written about the bizarre and unnatural behavior of the Russians when they liberated the camps, I interpreted your comment to refer to the idea that no camps were liberated because there were no camps, or some similar idea. We seem to be on more or less the same page about the Russian invasion into Germany.

I've been delving in denier depths lately but, still, I came across as a pompous asshole and completely misinterpreted your comment! My apologies!

[Sporky]

Damn Bolsheviks!

[madsherit]

This really is about power vs. the powerless, as others have pointed out. That anyone believes German women and children deserved this because of Nazi policies or German soldiers' behavior, is appalling. Rape has been a tool of war--approved and even encouraged in the Old Testament--since our beginnings. However, it doesn't have to occur; it's allowed to happen. Some of the things U.S. troops did to women in Vietnam are so foul I hate to think of them. Moreover, leaders of armies, including ours, travel with groups of prostitutes to "ease" the "sexual needs" of their troops in order to prevent rape. That says all we need to know, that our military commands equate normal sex with rape; that men can't live without sex and/or have no self-discipline whatsoever, and that one substitutes for the other. As long as such ignorance persists, the problem will remain.

Forcing others into sodomy, raping with knives, cutting off breasts, forced vaginal and oral sex, etc., are not part of normal human male behavior, period. If I believed those acts were part of all men, I wouldn't get out of bed in the morning. (And here, let's not confuse any of this with rape fantasies, which usually don't include using women and children's eyes as ashtrays.)

We can, and should, have a zero-tolerance policy on rape in the military, including the rape of our own troops by our own soldiers. It won't eliminate the problem, but it'll begin to diminish it. Perhaps, over time, it'll become a rare event.

Hitler was very wack-a-doo about the Russians. The way Russian POWs were treated vs. the British and Americans is telling. He was practically in awe of the latter, particularly pilots. Accordingly, Brit and US captives received far better treatment than Soviet POWs.

You'll see me write this a lot: My species baffles me.

[bando21]

that story was cute I like happy endings <3

[abryx]

Just a note from the other side:
My Grandmother was raped by an GI in Germany 1944 and my Mother was born as result. Grandmother knew his name but he refuses any responsibility also any efforts of contact by my mother and me.
In the view of our family and ex-nazi neighbors my mother was a unwelcome "Bastard" and later mee too.
All long time ago but in still in mind for the rest of life!

[Bundy12]

Rape is always bad.