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US and RUSSIA in Danger of Returning to Era of Nuclear Rivalry. 

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  #21  
Old 01-05-2015, 10:17 PM
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Re: US and RUSSIA in Danger of Returning to Era of Nuclear Rivalry.

The situation in the Ukraine is extremely complicated.

It's not simply a matter of Russian aggression.

There is a long, complicated history with Russia, and a very sizeable portion of the population that identifies as Russian.

The situation that led to the former government of Ukraine being toppled was extremely sketchy, parliamentary procedure for impeachment was not followed, and the government that took over did not follow procedure.
There is a lot of questions regarding who backed the coup, and the legitimacy of it.

Then there's the whole issue of NATO coming to Russia's doorstep, weather or not James Baker promised this would never happen as a condition of the dissolve of the communist bloc.......

The idea of going to war over this, on the other side of the world, is stupid, and it's none of our business.
The world police has bigger issues than this.

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  #22  
Old 01-06-2015, 10:19 AM
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Re: US and RUSSIA in Danger of Returning to Era of Nuclear Rivalry.

I tell you what's sketchy. Is the impeached president who was elected because he guaranteed he would sign EU agreement. And after he was elected he tore up the agreement and instead said they will partner economically with Russia.
Russia had their dirty hands all over the election.

Ukrainians thought during the election there was a Russian president and a Ukrainian President to chose from. But they were misled, both candidates were Russian picked. And they played both sides, so no matter who the people elected, a Russian puppet would win.

And from the reaction, I'm guessing what's happened was a contingency plan. Because the moves by Russia after the impeachment were swift and decisive. Feb 22 Ukraine Parliament votes to remove president. Feb 23 ousted Ukraine President appears on TV from Russia. Also on Feb 23 first Russian troops cross into Crimea. In less than a week Crimea is under total control of Russia. In less than 3 weeks Russia holds a sham election, in a country that's not there's. And claim total victory absorbing Crimea.

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  #23  
Old 01-06-2015, 10:37 AM
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Re: US and RUSSIA in Danger of Returning to Era of Nuclear Rivalry.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rob666 View Post
The situation in the Ukraine is extremely complicated.

It's not simply a matter of Russian aggression.

There is a long, complicated history with Russia, and a very sizeable portion of the population that identifies as Russian.

The situation that led to the former government of Ukraine being toppled was extremely sketchy, parliamentary procedure for impeachment was not followed, and the government that took over did not follow procedure.
There is a lot of questions regarding who backed the coup, and the legitimacy of it.

Then there's the whole issue of NATO coming to Russia's doorstep, weather or not James Baker promised this would never happen as a condition of the dissolve of the communist bloc.......

The idea of going to war over this, on the other side of the world, is stupid, and it's none of our business.
The world police has bigger issues than this.
Absolutely; Stalin and his cronies always saw the Ukrainians as untermensch and fomentors of unrest; the Holodomor was their punishment.

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  #24  
Old 01-06-2015, 11:02 AM
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Re: US and RUSSIA in Danger of Returning to Era of Nuclear Rivalry.

It is NOT complicated.

On the contrary, it's very simple

It's just Hitler/Stalin all over again.

This is an old story.

As old as Man.

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  #25  
Old 01-06-2015, 11:42 AM
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Re: US and RUSSIA in Danger of Returning to Era of Nuclear Rivalry.

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Originally Posted by Oswald2001 View Post
It is NOT complicated.

On the contrary, it's very simple

It's just Hitler/Stalin all over again.

This is an old story.

As old as Man.
Totally. History repeats itself. And we still never learn.

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  #26  
Old 01-06-2015, 12:22 PM
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Re: US and RUSSIA in Danger of Returning to Era of Nuclear Rivalry.

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The world has bigger issues than this
So the potential for a cold war going hot is not a serious problem in your mind?

A lot of ethnic Russians want to be a part of Russia. Ukraine was invaded and is seeing aggression towards its sovereign state. It doesn't help matters the USA engineered this whole "democracy" thing.

The US has too many fingers in too many pies.

- Afghanistan
- Pakistan
- Iraq
- South China Sea
- Parts of Africa
- Mexico
- South America
- Libya
- Egypt
- Ukraine
- Syria

Notice how all of these places are now worse off than before US involvement?

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  #27  
Old 01-06-2015, 01:45 PM
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Re: US and RUSSIA in Danger of Returning to Era of Nuclear Rivalry.

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Originally Posted by rob666 View Post
It's almost certain that OPEC not lowering it's prices, combined with America now being the biggest oil exporter, was engineered to hurt Russia.

Russia's entire economy is based on energy. The sanctions did nothing to hurt Putin, but as a result of falling oil prices Russia is in economic crisis.

Sometimes for an economically starved country, the best answer is war. Merkers salt mines comes to my mind, imperial pillaging has its payouts

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  #28  
Old 01-06-2015, 02:13 PM
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Re: US and RUSSIA in Danger of Returning to Era of Nuclear Rivalry.

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Originally Posted by ices View Post
So the potential for a cold war going hot is not a serious problem in your mind?

A lot of ethnic Russians want to be a part of Russia. Ukraine was invaded and is seeing aggression towards its sovereign state. It doesn't help matters the USA engineered this whole "democracy" thing.

The US has too many fingers in too many pies.

- Afghanistan
- Pakistan
- Iraq
- South China Sea
- Parts of Africa
- Mexico
- South America
- Libya
- Egypt
- Ukraine
- Syria

Notice how all of these places are now worse off than before US involvement?
The only thing that would make it go hot, as usual, is our involvement.
We haven't been in a war of necessity since Afghanistan, they have all been for oil or political gain.
This whole comparison to Hitler BS is dangerous, all a commentator or politician has to do is compare any situation to 1930s Europe and everybody turns into chicken little.


Putin supports a side in a civil war, no more and no less......... How many American troops are deployed in foreign bases around the world? How many civil wars do they intervene in to protect their interests?

What about irans nuke program?
What about North Korea?
What about ISIS?
What about the Taliban?
What about Pakistan?
What about china?
What about Libya?

And yet somehow, the Ukraine is going to be the flashpoint that starts WW3?
Somehow, for some reason, when Putin gets Ukraine he's going to invade Europe?

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  #29  
Old 01-06-2015, 02:14 PM
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Re: US and RUSSIA in Danger of Returning to Era of Nuclear Rivalry.

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Originally Posted by TheVrist View Post
Sometimes for an economically starved country, the best answer is war. Merkers salt mines comes to my mind, imperial pillaging has its payouts
Yes, but........ That being the case why would we want to push them to starvation?

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  #30  
Old 01-06-2015, 02:16 PM
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Re: US and RUSSIA in Danger of Returning to Era of Nuclear Rivalry.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oswald2001 View Post
It is NOT complicated.

On the contrary, it's very simple

It's just Hitler/Stalin all over again.

This is an old story.

As old as Man.
Putin going into Crimea is no worse than America intervening in the affairs of Iran, Iraq, Libya, or countless other places for economic or political gain.

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